OYSA convinces OPL to shut down their Fall league

[Unregistered]

If anything, it's more fractured, if not more confusing.

Less than 10 years ago there was one state-wide league with all teams in it. Now you have:

USSDA boys
ECNL girls
Thorns Academy girls
OYSA
FWRL
NWCL
RCL (for a few Vancouver teams)
Timbers Alliance
ODP
and probably a dozen other things, most of which are simply segmenting the market and driving up costs.

The OYSA has grown back to it's old membership numbers and the Timbers are able to make a buck running all these OYSA kiddo leagues. It is Less fractured since the old OPL teams joined the OYSA.

The fracturing has to do with creating the mirage leagues.
Mirage? yes leagues that have 4 to 6 letter acronym's that are simply illusions as the Portland market doesn't have an real quality teams loaded with quality players or coaches.

See these leagues:

Boys Timbers USSDA
U12 USSDA league for 04 boys
NWCL
ECNL

The FWRL and OYSA leagues have their same mettle as always.

In Oregon it's just a bunch of clubs fighting over paying players who will subsidize the inflated salaries needed for the front offices at the following clubs: BSC, THUSC, WST, EST, PCU, FC PDX, NEU, SSC, LOSC, WUSC, HSC & Foothills.

Outliers emerging from this systemic sickness are clubs centered around a private trainer who wants to copy the big dogs; see NSC & ADF.


Daycare soccer with daycare coaches and idiot parents forking over the cash. Chasing the dream.



Instead of building strong clubs with strong coaches it's all about the benjamin's..

[Unregistered]

The OYSA has grown back to it's old membership numbers and the Timbers are able to make a buck running all these OYSA kiddo leagues. It is Less fractured since the old OPL teams joined the OYSA.

The fracturing has to do with creating the mirage leagues.
Mirage? yes leagues that have 4 to 6 letter acronym's that are simply illusions as the Portland market doesn't have an real quality teams loaded with quality players or coaches.

See these leagues:

Boys Timbers USSDA
U12 USSDA league for 04 boys
NWCL
ECNL

The FWRL and OYSA leagues have their same mettle as always.

In Oregon it's just a bunch of clubs fighting over paying players who will subsidize the inflated salaries needed for the front offices at the following clubs: BSC, THUSC, WST, EST, PCU, FC PDX, NEU, SSC, LOSC, WUSC, HSC & Foothills.

Outliers emerging from this systemic sickness are clubs centered around a private trainer who wants to copy the big dogs; see NSC & ADF.


Daycare soccer with daycare coaches and idiot parents forking over the cash. Chasing the dream.



Instead of building strong clubs with strong coaches it's all about the benjamin's..

Blah, blah your point is anything USYSA is good and everything else is bad? Oh yeh and the clubs only care about is making $?

You don't know **** my cynical friend of what motivates these clubs.

[Unregistered]

Blah, blah your point is anything USYSA is good and everything else is bad? Oh yeh and the clubs only care about is making $?

You don't know **** my cynical friend of what motivates these clubs.

Source Guidestar

Portland City United Soccer Club Inc
Income: $1,326,748
Portland , OR 97232

WILLAMETTE UNITED SOCCER CLUB INC
Income: $1,309,335
West Linn, OR 97068

F C PORTLAND SOCCER ACADEMY
Income: $1,018,237
Hillsboro, OR 97124

WESTSIDE METROS SOCCER CLUB
Income: $1,011,169
Beaverton, OR 97005

BSC PORTLAND
Income: $989,191
Portland, OR 97221

LAKE OSWEGO SOCCER CLUB
Income: $977,526
Lake Oswego, OR 97035

AKA Crossfire
OSWEGO SOUTHSIDE SOCCER ACADEMY
Income: $760,599
Lake Oswego, OR 97035


EASTSIDE TIMBERS
Income: $771,719
Gladstone, OR 97027

TUALATIN HILLS UNITED SOCCER CLUB
Income: $624,723
Portland, OR 97229

SOUTHSIDE SOCCER CLUB
Income: $510,914
Tigard, OR 97281

HILLSBORO SOCCER CLUB
Income: $435,543
Hillsboro, OR 97124

HILLSIDE SOCCER CLUB INC
Income: $325,463
Portland, OR 97296

Now many of these clubs get a large chunk of their revenue from recreational fees, camps and their tournaments (WUSC nearly 45% of their annual revenue from a tournament)...

So if you want to know these startling details:
The Highest Paid Employee data for 2015, 2014, 2013, 2012, 2010, 2009 just do a little bit of digging you won't be cynical, you will be sick.

[Unregistered]

Source Guidestar

Portland City United Soccer Club Inc
Income: $1,326,748
Portland , OR 97232

WILLAMETTE UNITED SOCCER CLUB INC
Income: $1,309,335
West Linn, OR 97068

F C PORTLAND SOCCER ACADEMY
Income: $1,018,237
Hillsboro, OR 97124

WESTSIDE METROS SOCCER CLUB
Income: $1,011,169
Beaverton, OR 97005

BSC PORTLAND
Income: $989,191
Portland, OR 97221

LAKE OSWEGO SOCCER CLUB
Income: $977,526
Lake Oswego, OR 97035

AKA Crossfire
OSWEGO SOUTHSIDE SOCCER ACADEMY
Income: $760,599
Lake Oswego, OR 97035


EASTSIDE TIMBERS
Income: $771,719
Gladstone, OR 97027

TUALATIN HILLS UNITED SOCCER CLUB
Income: $624,723
Portland, OR 97229

SOUTHSIDE SOCCER CLUB
Income: $510,914
Tigard, OR 97281

HILLSBORO SOCCER CLUB
Income: $435,543
Hillsboro, OR 97124

HILLSIDE SOCCER CLUB INC
Income: $325,463
Portland, OR 97296

Now many of these clubs get a large chunk of their revenue from recreational fees, camps and their tournaments (WUSC nearly 45% of their annual revenue from a tournament)...

So if you want to know these startling details:
The Highest Paid Employee data for 2015, 2014, 2013, 2012, 2010, 2009 just do a little bit of digging you won't be cynical, you will be sick.

There are plenty of good people in those clubs who volunteer their time to keep it going - board members, etc. Maybe they think it will help their kid, maybe they do it to further their professional contacts, maybe a genuine interest in kids and the game. If you think their motivation with respect to the club is strictly financial, your dead wrong.

As for the "highest paid" staff members in each club, including some DOCs - they live in the same crazy real estate markets the rest of us do. If this is their profession they need to earn a living. Knowing a couple of them, think it is absolutely inaccurate to assume they are motivated strictly by $.

Are some of them overpaid? Yes. But it isn't United Way kind of crazy and some of them in my opinion are underpaid.

As for the 20 something kids coaching at some of these clubs, you might be shocked out how little they really make.

As for the coaches who take on a team or 2 per season and have a separate career, again you are completely off base if you think $ is what motivates them with respect to coaching.

[Unregistered]

There are plenty of good people in those clubs who volunteer their time to keep it going - board members, etc. Maybe they think it will help their kid, maybe they do it to further their professional contacts, maybe a genuine interest in kids and the game. If you think their motivation with respect to the club is strictly financial, your dead wrong.

As for the "highest paid" staff members in each club, including some DOCs - they live in the same crazy real estate markets the rest of us do. If this is their profession they need to earn a living. Knowing a couple of them, think it is absolutely inaccurate to assume they are motivated strictly by $.

Are some of them overpaid? Yes. But it isn't United Way kind of crazy and some of them in my opinion are underpaid.

As for the 20 something kids coaching at some of these clubs, you might be shocked out how little they really make.

As for the coaches who take on a team or 2 per season and have a separate career, again you are completely off base if you think $ is what motivates them with respect to coaching.

Agreed. If you dont want to pay $1500-2000 year, then play rec with volunteer coaches. Easy!

[Unregistered]

There are plenty of good people in those clubs who volunteer their time to keep it going - board members, etc. Maybe they think it will help their kid, maybe they do it to further their professional contacts, maybe a genuine interest in kids and the game. If you think their motivation with respect to the club is strictly financial, your dead wrong.

As for the "highest paid" staff members in each club, including some DOCs - they live in the same crazy real estate markets the rest of us do. If this is their profession they need to earn a living. Knowing a couple of them, think it is absolutely inaccurate to assume they are motivated strictly by $.

Are some of them overpaid? Yes. But it isn't United Way kind of crazy and some of them in my opinion are underpaid.

As for the 20 something kids coaching at some of these clubs, you might be shocked out how little they really make.

As for the coaches who take on a team or 2 per season and have a separate career, again you are completely off base if you think $ is what motivates them with respect to coaching.

There is only one I have seen that looks astronomical.

[Unregistered]

There is only one I have seen that looks astronomical.

Anything over 40k to 50k for any DOC of a classic kiddie pdx area club seems astronomical.

Without any qualifications other than a love for soccer necessary.

When you have a DOC, operations person and registrar pulling in between $300K to 400K between the 3 of them that resembles a fortune 500 front office not a local rec/classic soccer club.

Most DOC's of the clubs listed are at or above 6 figures, 2nd in command close to 6 figures and 3rd in command between $80K & 100K.

Most starters on the MLS timbers don't get paid this amount annually.

Their MLS business is worth hundreds of millions while these clubs have an income of around just 1 million.

So, you want to convince me they don't hurt if players leave since they have only 15 to 30 classic teams supporting these front office salaries? They can't afford to have you leave.

Do you think they could get this type of income in the real world of business?

[Unregistered]

Anything over 40k to 50k for any DOC of a classic kiddie pdx area club seems astronomical.

Without any qualifications other than a love for soccer necessary.

When you have a DOC, operations person and registrar pulling in between $300K to 400K between the 3 of them that resembles a fortune 500 front office not a local rec/classic soccer club.

Most DOC's of the clubs listed are at or above 6 figures, 2nd in command close to 6 figures and 3rd in command between $80K & 100K.

Most starters on the MLS timbers don't get paid this amount annually.

Their MLS business is worth hundreds of millions while these clubs have an income of around just 1 million.

So, you want to convince me they don't hurt if players leave since they have only 15 to 30 classic teams supporting these front office salaries? They can't afford to have you leave.

Do you think they could get this type of income in the real world of business?

Without getting into the details only one I have come across did I think was truly shocking amount of spend.

A $1 million non-profit needs real management and for that you have to pay. Sure some these guys may treat their jobs like ski bums, others are too big, but that is true with plenty of non-profits and other businesses.

Occasionally I hear parents make a statement that a club is doing this or that strictly for the $ - clubs' motivations aren't always holy, but $ is rarely the sole consideration.

In terms of qualifications, current A or B license, X number of years coaching in club environment are minimums with the job descriptions I've seen.

As for MLS v. some of these clubs, latter doesn't report anything other than player and head coach salaries, so no real way to compare. Suspect ex-players are doing quite well there.

Apply scrutiny to these clubs is fair; blindly labeling every decision as financially driven is simply wrong (even if the non-financial reasons for doing something aren't always altruistic either).

[Unregistered]

Anything over 40k to 50k for any DOC of a classic kiddie pdx area club seems astronomical.

Without any qualifications other than a love for soccer necessary.

When you have a DOC, operations person and registrar pulling in between $300K to 400K between the 3 of them that resembles a fortune 500 front office not a local rec/classic soccer club.

Most DOC's of the clubs listed are at or above 6 figures, 2nd in command close to 6 figures and 3rd in command between $80K & 100K.

Most starters on the MLS timbers don't get paid this amount annually.

Their MLS business is worth hundreds of millions while these clubs have an income of around just 1 million.

So, you want to convince me they don't hurt if players leave since they have only 15 to 30 classic teams supporting these front office salaries? They can't afford to have you leave.

Do you think they could get this type of income in the real world of business?

Looked at several big-name clubs in town:

One of them had a few compensated board members (paid in the $20ks); the others I checked had all-volunteer boards (compensation of zero).

None listed any employees making six figures--nonprofits are required to list their top five employess (if any) with a salary that large.

One designated two "key employees" and listed their compensation (the DoC and another well-known coach), both of whom work full time; neither was paid a six-figure salary (salaries for both were in the mid-high five figures). The other clubs I looked at did not name any key employees. (Form 990 required disclosure of salaries of board members, officers, "key employees", top five over $100k, and former members/employees still on payroll).

One of the clubs had a surprisingly low amount of cash on hand (less than 1/20 of revenue); the others I looked had six figure bank accounts.

Perhaps I picked the wrong clubs to look at... but since this information is public anyway, you might state which clubs you think have excessive compensation for their directors or coaches, rather that simply listing half the clubs in town.

[Unregistered]

Without getting into the details only one I have come across did I think was truly shocking amount of spend.

A $1 million non-profit needs real management and for that you have to pay. Sure some these guys may treat their jobs like ski bums, others are too big, but that is true with plenty of non-profits and other businesses.

Occasionally I hear parents make a statement that a club is doing this or that strictly for the $ - clubs' motivations aren't always holy, but $ is rarely the sole consideration.

In terms of qualifications, current A or B license, X number of years coaching in club environment are minimums with the job descriptions I've seen.

As for MLS v. some of these clubs, latter doesn't report anything other than player and head coach salaries, so no real way to compare. Suspect ex-players are doing quite well there.

Apply scrutiny to these clubs is fair; blindly labeling every decision as financially driven is simply wrong (even if the non-financial reasons for doing something aren't always altruistic either).

No business profit or non-profit would earmark 30% to 40% of their annual gross to 'real management' concentrated on just 2 or 3 people. A for profit business would be out of business and wouldn't have the cash flow to cover this type of management expense. Non-profits like soccer clubs don't pay property or income tax so they will have the advantage of keeping money away from Uncle Sam. They avoid the overhead costs of owning land and having to pay for field replacement and maintenance as a fixed cost, most have community government owned fields they lease or get on the cheap, since they are indeed a community non-profit club. Without this governmental aid to the clubs with field usage your fees would be triple fold to just to keep up the salaries currently paid and pay for the dirt they play on.

Without getting into details all of them (DOC'S of the clubs listed) are between 90k to 150K roughly which is truly an eyeopener and shocking in this present economy and the qualitative level of skill and talent in the Portland area. The Salem Capital Timbers club which resembles many of the Portland area clubs in quality and in size pays it DOC well below 30K a year. We can agree to disagree what is shocking to each of us, noted. Let's cut to the chase they are all doing it for money, & a being involved in a sport they love unless they think this is a scratch off ticket that gives them this annual payoff, they don't.

Funny you bring up ex players of the Timbers and salaries one of them (ex player) makes nearly 3x as much as a DOC for a neighborhood club in PDX then he did as a USL Timber. Crazy but true.

Never seen a list of qualifications needed to be a neighborhood DOC it varies for sure.

You would have to be blind not to appreciate the economics of having to set aside $400K a year out of a million dollar gross, for front office staff, not to mention paying a stable of low wage team coaches another 150K to 300K between 20 to 30 part-time coaches.

If these clubs get forced to pay the actual cost of building their own facilities and the schools and park districts tell them they are no longer allowed on them you would see the high salaries vanish or your fees sky rocket.

But then wouldn't talking about community clubs for kids.

[Unregistered]

Looked at several big-name clubs in town:

One of them had a few compensated board members (paid in the $20ks); the others I checked had all-volunteer boards (compensation of zero).

None listed any employees making six figures--nonprofits are required to list their top five employess (if any) with a salary that large.

One designated two "key employees" and listed their compensation (the DoC and another well-known coach), both of whom work full time; neither was paid a six-figure salary (salaries for both were in the mid-high five figures). The other clubs I looked at did not name any key employees. (Form 990 required disclosure of salaries of board members, officers, "key employees", top five over $100k, and former members/employees still on payroll).

One of the clubs had a surprisingly low amount of cash on hand (less than 1/20 of revenue); the others I looked had six figure bank accounts.

Perhaps I picked the wrong clubs to look at... but since this information is public anyway, you might state which clubs you think have excessive compensation for their directors or coaches, rather that simply listing half the clubs in town.

If you pay for the Premium access in guidestar you can view the w-2 wages, 1099 and much more. That's on you to dig, dig it.

[Unregistered]

If you pay for the Premium access in guidestar you can view the w-2 wages, 1099 and much more. That's on you to dig, dig it.

Done it. Not shocked except maybe with respect to how much PCU pays and how little Westside does (but heck Cony is half-socialist so maybe he doesn't care).

Maybe these non-profits can pay higher because of their tax status, but the market that exists with the current regime is what generally dictates these salaries.

[Unregistered]

Done it. Not shocked except maybe with respect to how much PCU pays and how little Westside does (but heck Cony is half-socialist so maybe he doesn't care).

Maybe these non-profits can pay higher because of their tax status, but the market that exists with the current regime is what generally dictates these salaries.

When you say 'market' you mean the relationship between the club president and the DOC and the look the other way board of directors.

There is no rhyme or reason to these salaries other than the ask to the club President.

[Unregistered]

When you say 'market' you mean the relationship between the club president and the DOC and the look the other way board of directors.

There is no rhyme or reason to these salaries other than the ask to the club President.

Nope, I mean going out and looking at what others are paying for comparable roles. Many non-profits do it (as best they can), including soccer clubs.

[Unregistered]

Done it. Not shocked except maybe with respect to how much PCU pays and how little Westside does (but heck Cony is half-socialist so maybe he doesn't care).

Maybe these non-profits can pay higher because of their tax status, but the market that exists with the current regime is what generally dictates these salaries.

Since we all have a ball park idea that 10-12 local DOC's make around 6 figures annually which is interesting.

As a business person I would salary someone at this type of wage if they showed the type of achievement and performance that warranted this type of pay. Westside over the last 10 years has around 60 to 75 OYSA State Cup Champions, Regional titles, National Cup teams, MLS players, US National team youth players & 100's of college players and they have the lowest paid DOC in the region?

While BSC and PCU have DOC's with and handful of state cup titles over the last 10 years and get paid much, much more.

That isn't a market reaction, it's a visceral reaction.