Referees call the game too soft

[Unregistered]

I don't see how either of you can make blanket statements about an entire nationality of people when you each seem to just like insulting each other. You should both be ashamed.

As for refereeing, niether one of you know what your talking about.

[Unregistered]

You are correct on many points

with each post you show your last of knowledge and history guess my work is done lol.

lets get back to football yes football not soccer you cant even get that right go back to the rock you were living under and give the real people both American and Brits talk about things that are inline with the thread and not nasty comments that you and your kind get off on on this blog.

small minded people of any nationality always balls it up for the people who want to move things forward. Hope this idiot hasnt driven us off topic

In regards to the slide tackle: It is actively discouraged under U12 consequently few referee's are used to the results of a correctly executed tackle when they are calling older players games.

You are absolutely correct that officials have a reflexive habit of calling a foul when the tackled player hits the ground regardless of the cleanness of the tackle. At the college and professional level good tackling technique is what separates the average player from the top tier and holding their development back at the younger ages does not do US players any favors.

The biggest mistake I see in how NW referees call a foul on the tackle is determining if the attack came from behind and or resulted in non-ball contact.

It makes me sad to see a perfectly executed tackle from the side or even the front create ball contact that makes the offensive play fall down and draw a foul or worse a card from an official.

It also makes me sad for the players when they execute a perfect slide from the side and knock the ball away cleanly and still draw a foul call because the referee was out of position to determine the angel.

Memo to the referees: In these instances if the offensive player does not go down you should swallow that whistle!

Some day the US will realize that getting by on the cheap for premier level officiating is part of the problem of the development of US youth soccer development and do something about the training and development of officials....someday.

[Wolves FC]

very well said

[Unregistered]

I agree partially

In regards to the slide tackle: It is actively discouraged under U12 consequently few referee's are used to the results of a correctly executed tackle when they are calling older players games.

You are absolutely correct that officials have a reflexive habit of calling a foul when the tackled player hits the ground regardless of the cleanness of the tackle. At the college and professional level good tackling technique is what separates the average player from the top tier and holding their development back at the younger ages does not do US players any favors.

The biggest mistake I see in how NW referees call a foul on the tackle is determining if the attack came from behind and or resulted in non-ball contact.

It makes me sad to see a perfectly executed tackle from the side or even the front create ball contact that makes the offensive play fall down and draw a foul or worse a card from an official.

It also makes me sad for the players when they execute a perfect slide from the side and knock the ball away cleanly and still draw a foul call because the referee was out of position to determine the angel.

Memo to the referees: In these instances if the offensive player does not go down you should swallow that whistle!

Some day the US will realize that getting by on the cheap for premier level officiating is part of the problem of the development of US youth soccer development and do something about the training and development of officials....someday.

I agree that very often refs are out of position and call a foul on a slide tackle if a player goes down. Part of this reflex is due to how many slide tackles are fouls. Better refs always help. However, I think that poor reffing is a very minor part of US youth soccer development. So minor, it isn't in the top 25 for me.

In regards to the gentleman (or woman) talking about British soccer, my guess is hasn't been to Britain to see a game in 5,10,20 or so years. If he had he would know that US youth teams are often thought to be too physical.

[Unregistered]

Ref's are in the Top 5

I agree that very often refs are out of position and call a foul on a slide tackle if a player goes down. Part of this reflex is due to how many slide tackles are fouls. Better refs always help. However, I think that poor reffing is a very minor part of US youth soccer development. So minor, it isn't in the top 25 for me.

In regards to the gentleman (or woman) talking about British soccer, my guess is hasn't been to Britain to see a game in 5,10,20 or so years. If he had he would know that US youth teams are often thought to be too physical.

Respectfully how can you say poor officiating is so far down the list when the result consistently discourage players from sticking with the game and create such hostile environments on the sidelines.

You can teach players properly technique, skill and strategy and have all that blown up by ref's who can't make a proper offsides call on an overlap or screw up slide tackles or generally can control a match which sours the taste of the game for both the players and the fans.

Go to the semi finals and finals of the up coming State Cups and watch how differently they are called than the league games and see how a game is supposed to administered. Very few cards, active instruction/warnings, proper positioning of both the center and the AR's.

There is now way to move the game forward in this country with out moving the officiating forward to after all they have the "final" say on the pitch and if that final say is consistently lacking credibility then you have a sport that is lacking credibility too.

[Unregistered]

Learning to play physical

I coach and teach my kids to "kill or be killed." I don't call many fouls at practice because "Referees are bad." My kids kill other teams and protect the ball very well.

What I want to say is these kids don't play street soccer that leads to fights. Soccer isn't a part of their culture they would go to war for. They don't play in the streets across from men and older players. They are defined to an age group and if they're lucky play during recess.

I don't know if america is capable of producing a Carlos Tevez.

[Unregistered]

I coach and teach my kids to "kill or be killed." I don't call many fouls at practice because "Referees are bad." My kids kill other teams and protect the ball very well.

What I want to say is these kids don't play street soccer that leads to fights. Soccer isn't a part of their culture they would go to war for. They don't play in the streets across from men and older players. They are defined to an age group and if they're lucky play during recess.

I don't know if america is capable of producing a Carlos Tevez.

Tevez is a pussy.

[Unregistered]

I read posts from people whom I am guessing are non-referees talking about perfectly executed slide tackles... I don't think you know what one is. Ball first does not make a tackle legal. Too often refs are admonished for getting calls right. Think about this as well; u13 players are at a level similar to the referees that are calling their games for their respective crafts. It is so rediculous to hear parents of the youngers complain about calls. These are likely the same parents that are having a coronary over a throw-in call near midfield.

Coaches coach.
Players play.
Parents drive to the game and cheer.
Referees ref.

[Unregistered]

If only

I read posts from people whom I am guessing are non-referees talking about perfectly executed slide tackles... I don't think you know what one is. Ball first does not make a tackle legal. Too often refs are admonished for getting calls right. Think about this as well; u13 players are at a level similar to the referees that are calling their games for their respective crafts. It is so rediculous to hear parents of the youngers complain about calls. These are likely the same parents that are having a coronary over a throw-in call near midfield.

Coaches coach.
Players play.
Parents drive to the game and cheer.
Referees ref.

Watch a correctly administered game and you will hear very few complaints from either sideline. Watching a game where the AR's don't have a clue where the forward was at the time of the kick and you will rightly hear complaints. Watch a game where the center is consistently 30 yards behind the action and you will hear complaints about long distance foul calls. Watch a game where the center doesn't understand what advantage means and you will hear the side of the team who GOT the call complaining too.

Bottom line is that today youth officiating is not very professional and expecting parents to spend $7-10,000 only to have refs spoil the game is NOT acceptable. The solution is not rocket science or even a novel concept. Pay more, train more, expect more and lastly GET more from the officiating.

[Unregistered]

Please give us your interpretation of a correct slide tackle

I read posts from people whom I am guessing are non-referees talking about perfectly executed slide tackles... I don't think you know what one is. Ball first does not make a tackle legal. Too often refs are admonished for getting calls right. Think about this as well; u13 players are at a level similar to the referees that are calling their games for their respective crafts. It is so rediculous to hear parents of the youngers complain about calls. These are likely the same parents that are having a coronary over a throw-in call near midfield.

Coaches coach.
Players play.
Parents drive to the game and cheer.
Referees ref.

Since you purport to know the mechanics of a proper slide tackle please share with us.... seriously!

[Unregistered]

Full time players & coaches and part time officials

Bottom line is that today youth officiating is not very professional and expecting parents to spend $7-10,000 only to have refs spoil the game is NOT acceptable. The solution is not rocket science or even a novel concept. Pay more, train more, expect more and lastly GET more from the officiating.[/QUOTE]

If find ironic that premier level clubs demand so much time of their players perfecting the game yet they allow the games to be called by officials who are not asked to commit a similar amount of time and effort perfecting their craft!

I know we don't pay them enough to be anything other than part time but seriously shouldn't we expect a little more effort on their part?

[Unregistered]

Since you purport to know the mechanics of a proper slide tackle please share with us.... seriously!

As for the mechanics of the tackle, not sure. As for the interpretation of its legality I'll give it a shot. I appreciate the opportunity w/o mud-slinging.

First of all, I'm not on here claiming to be the best referee ever, but I will say that I've had some success at it and refereed at a fairly high level when I was a bit younger. I am still involved, but not like I used I be. I do keep up with the current interpretations. For me, a slide tackle is legal if the player attempting the tackle makes contact with the ball and the ensuing contact - assuming there is some which is usually the case - is initiated by the attacking player. Example, player comes in from the side, gets ball, attacker's forward momentum carries him/her into the tackler resulting in the fall. Example of a foul, player comes from the side/back/front and gets ball first but tackler's momentum initiates the contact with the attacker whether it be by a swinging leg or sliding into the opponent. So I guess what I look for is who is creating the contact, not whether the ball was hit first. We are currently being asked to consider the speed with which the tackler comes in as well as the opportunity (not intent) to injure.

Again, like any judgement call people will disagree on who initiates, etc. and that is fine. Hope this makes some sense, and I am interested in your comments...seriously!

[Unregistered]

Good start

As for the mechanics of the tackle, not sure. As for the interpretation of its legality I'll give it a shot. I appreciate the opportunity w/o mud-slinging.

First of all, I'm not on here claiming to be the best referee ever, but I will say that I've had some success at it and refereed at a fairly high level when I was a bit younger. I am still involved, but not like I used I be. I do keep up with the current interpretations. For me, a slide tackle is legal if the player attempting the tackle makes contact with the ball and the ensuing contact - assuming there is some which is usually the case - is initiated by the attacking player. Example, player comes in from the side, gets ball, attacker's forward momentum carries him/her into the tackler resulting in the fall. Example of a foul, player comes from the side/back/front and gets ball first but tackler's momentum initiates the contact with the attacker whether it be by a swinging leg or sliding into the opponent. So I guess what I look for is who is creating the contact, not whether the ball was hit first. We are currently being asked to consider the speed with which the tackler comes in as well as the opportunity (not intent) to injure.

Again, like any judgement call people will disagree on who initiates, etc. and that is fine. Hope this makes some sense, and I am interested in your comments...seriously!

I can accept that interpretation how ever what I see too often called a foul is where the tackler makes contact with the ball and the BALL then trips the other player and they go down. IMHO that is a properly executed tackle.

I also have a problem with fouls called for dribblers tripping over the tackler after the ball has been knocked away getting a foul called. When I watch MLS or EPL I do not set the player with possession getting this call.

[Unregistered]

As for the mechanics of the tackle, not sure. As for the interpretation of its legality I'll give it a shot. I appreciate the opportunity w/o mud-slinging.

First of all, I'm not on here claiming to be the best referee ever, but I will say that I've had some success at it and refereed at a fairly high level when I was a bit younger. I am still involved, but not like I used I be. I do keep up with the current interpretations. For me, a slide tackle is legal if the player attempting the tackle makes contact with the ball and the ensuing contact - assuming there is some which is usually the case - is initiated by the attacking player. Example, player comes in from the side, gets ball, attacker's forward momentum carries him/her into the tackler resulting in the fall. Example of a foul, player comes from the side/back/front and gets ball first but tackler's momentum initiates the contact with the attacker whether it be by a swinging leg or sliding into the opponent. So I guess what I look for is who is creating the contact, not whether the ball was hit first. We are currently being asked to consider the speed with which the tackler comes in as well as the opportunity (not intent) to injure.

Again, like any judgement call people will disagree on who initiates, etc. and that is fine. Hope this makes some sense, and I am interested in your comments...seriously!

This post is helpful and from what I know a good interpretation of the rule. As you mention, it is certainly a judgment call. So, even the educated will sometimes disagree and you see this at all levels.

[Unregistered]

Watch a correctly administered game and you will hear very few complaints from either sideline. Watching a game where the AR's don't have a clue where the forward was at the time of the kick and you will rightly hear complaints. Watch a game where the center is consistently 30 yards behind the action and you will hear complaints about long distance foul calls. Watch a game where the center doesn't understand what advantage means and you will hear the side of the team who GOT the call complaining too.

Bottom line is that today youth officiating is not very professional and expecting parents to spend $7-10,000 only to have refs spoil the game is NOT acceptable. The solution is not rocket science or even a novel concept. Pay more, train more, expect more and lastly GET more from the officiating.

While I generally agree with the fact that the better the ref and his/her AR's the fewer complaints you will hear. You still hear complaints from the fans with even the best refs. Part of this is the bias with which they enter the game and part of it is, frankly, ignorance. But, your point is still well made. The real issue is not the amout of complaints you hear but how it actually impacts the outcome of the match.