Saying The Quiet Part Out Loud

[Guest]

Back to the original topic, this podcast is gold about how ECNL girls soccer is a “train wreck”. It makes the point that the “elite” league experience is an expensive failure, if you measure it by the quality of development, and the quality of player education. It makes the fundamental point that these player identification platforms are showcasing a really poor product because the clubs selling the leagues are really bad at player education. And they don’t need to be good at player education because parents and players keep coming to them and writing big checks for ECNL. In the end, I think the conclusion is ECNL just not financially ir developmentally a great decision Definitely worth a listen: https://youtu.be/8z3JvM-c4ZM?si=xPmcxUIkSFeFLMyG

[Guest]

Back to the original topic, this podcast is gold about how ECNL girls soccer is a “train wreck”. It makes the point that the “elite” league experience is an expensive failure, if you measure it by the quality of development, and the quality of player education. It makes the fundamental point that these player identification platforms are showcasing a really poor product because the clubs selling the leagues are really bad at player education. And they don’t need to be good at player education because parents and players keep coming to them and writing big checks for ECNL. In the end, I think the conclusion is ECNL just not financially ir developmentally a great decision Definitely worth a listen: https://youtu.be/8z3JvM-c4ZM?si=xPmcxUIkSFeFLMyG

Is it a wreck locally? Or just in general?

[Guest]

Is it a wreck locally? Or just in general?

Both. The common refrain on this forum is that the top clubs in the area showcase players, they don't develop them. ...and since there's enough talent and out-of-club development in this area, there's little incentive to develop players.

[Guest]

Ok, let be be clear. At the position. 1 or 2 players is faster, scores more goals, and wait wait, the other team game plans for them.

Thus that player or those players be better than the player they selected to go to national team camp or the ecnl showcase.

I l clear now?

Numbers do lie.

The ESL alert sirens or screaming right now

[Guest]

Both. The common refrain on this forum is that the top clubs in the area showcase players, they don't develop them. ...and since there's enough talent and out-of-club development in this area, there's little incentive to develop players.

So what would you do to develop them? Specifics, please.

[Guest]

So what would you do to develop them? Specifics, please.

I made the post you quoted. I'm not an authority on how much the local clubs develop players, I'm just repeating what other people on this forum say. I have minimal experience with soccer development, but I'll take a stab at it based on my experience in a professional setting (corporate bs, not soccer):

1. set long-term objectives (what does a professional soccer player need to be good at? these would be my long-term objectives)
2. set short-term objectives that build toward the long-term ones (for each of those things a professional needs, what are the steps to get there?)
3. put the team and individuals in a position to test short-term objectives (give players an increasing amount of responsibility in their roles, tactics, competition, etc)
4. periodically evaluate on short-term goals
5. identify areas that need improvement
6. create an improvement plan that will help team or individual reach goals
7. monitor improvement.

My experience in the corporate world is that short-term goals are created with no thought given to long-term ones. Leaders have objectives at-odds with individuals objectives. Leaders will give their people opportunities, but will avoid doing so if they fear that it will impact their own objectives. Weaknesses are sometimes identified, but rarely is an improvement plan created; people are told they need to improve with no guidance or opportunities to do so.

[Guest]

I made the post you quoted. I'm not an authority on how much the local clubs develop players, I'm just repeating what other people on this forum say. I have minimal experience with soccer development, but I'll take a stab at it based on my experience in a professional setting (corporate bs, not soccer):

1. set long-term objectives (what does a professional soccer player need to be good at? these would be my long-term objectives)
2. set short-term objectives that build toward the long-term ones (for each of those things a professional needs, what are the steps to get there?)
3. put the team and individuals in a position to test short-term objectives (give players an increasing amount of responsibility in their roles, tactics, competition, etc)
4. periodically evaluate on short-term goals
5. identify areas that need improvement
6. create an improvement plan that will help team or individual reach goals
7. monitor improvement.

My experience in the corporate world is that short-term goals are created with no thought given to long-term ones. Leaders have objectives at-odds with individuals objectives. Leaders will give their people opportunities, but will avoid doing so if they fear that it will impact their own objectives. Weaknesses are sometimes identified, but rarely is an improvement plan created; people are told they need to improve with no guidance or opportunities to do so.

Extremely well thought out answer. Would be curious to hear what the soccer cognoscenti think of it.

[Guest]

Extremely well thought out answer. Would be curious to hear what the soccer cognoscenti think of it.

None of this matter because 99.9999999 % of the kids don't have the talent and no amt. of try hard or big bucks $$$$$$$ will over come it

[Guest]

Big question is who is going to pay for this awesome improvement plan to the youth soccer development? In the corporate world it’s either investors or the corporate profits, but who is paying in our case? I am pretty sure your $3k a year won’t even cover 20% of what you are proposing here.

[Guest]

Big question is who is going to pay for this awesome improvement plan to the youth soccer development? In the corporate world it’s either investors or the corporate profits, but who is paying in our case? I am pretty sure your $3k a year won’t even cover 20% of what you are proposing here.

It absolutely can and it should! Are you saying that coaches at these big clubs cannot set short-term and long-term objectives for their teams and their players and then monitor and evaluate progress? That’s exactly what they should be doing. Of course, if a coach has 3 teams because they are paid by the team and are in it for the money, then they definitely won’t do it. The starting point is for parents to demand that clubs not assign more than two teams per coach and ideally just one team per coach.

[Guest]

Ok, let be be clear. At the position. 1 or 2 players is faster, scores more goals, and wait wait, the other team game plans for them.

Thus that player or those players be better than the player they selected to go to national team camp or the ecnl showcase.

I l clear now?

Numbers do lie.

If numbers lie then the fact that 1 or 2 players score more goals is a lie too?

[Guest]

I made the post you quoted. I'm not an authority on how much the local clubs develop players, I'm just repeating what other people on this forum say. I have minimal experience with soccer development, but I'll take a stab at it based on my experience in a professional setting (corporate bs, not soccer):

1. set long-term objectives (what does a professional soccer player need to be good at? these would be my long-term objectives)
2. set short-term objectives that build toward the long-term ones (for each of those things a professional needs, what are the steps to get there?)
3. put the team and individuals in a position to test short-term objectives (give players an increasing amount of responsibility in their roles, tactics, competition, etc)
4. periodically evaluate on short-term goals
5. identify areas that need improvement
6. create an improvement plan that will help team or individual reach goals
7. monitor improvement.

My experience in the corporate world is that short-term goals are created with no thought given to long-term ones. Leaders have objectives at-odds with individuals objectives. Leaders will give their people opportunities, but will avoid doing so if they fear that it will impact their own objectives. Weaknesses are sometimes identified, but rarely is an improvement plan created; people are told they need to improve with no guidance or opportunities to do so.

This is understandable in theory. It seems more like the way European countries like Spain and Netherlands approach soccer development, which truly is development with a plan and consistency. Another key part is to understand what are the fundamentals of really high level soccer. We seem to skip those and go right to run hard, force it, shoot and score without any concept that this is low level and skips developing the key components required at the top levels. We also need to lean into how childhood development and effective learning occurs, we obviously don't care to look into these things because we are playing boot and pray at so much of the college and pro levels and have elementary ball control - generally speaking. To borrow a line from Kobe Bryant, the US is playing checkers and these other countries are out there playing chess.

[Guest]

Stop with the over seas hype. They biggest group of quality female soccer players are home group USA players. Most of our girls want to play in college. The national team has to a better job of IDing and using the talent that we have.

One starter for the USWNT played in a European league; Lindsey Horan plays for Lyon in France. Almost all the starters for the two teams that reached the final play in European leagues. Doesn't that say something about the current level of development in the US?

[Guest]

No, it says that the women league is the us is not very good.

[Guest]

Doesn't that say something about the current level of development in the US?

It does, but the European development is fueled by the home leagues, and the top leagues the clubs can sell their players to. MLS and lack of pro/rel is the main culprit the home player development in US sucks compared to Europe. So stop blaming the grassroots clubs in the area for not having a financial incentive to develop your DS/DD for professional football.