FC West Santos Jr (BU11) thrown out of State Cup

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Never heard of a team getting the boot for a badly behaved player, only roster issues. Happens all the time in youth sports sadly enough - look at that Jackie Robinson Little League team that was getting national attention. Turned out they fudged the rosters too (I think with out of district players?).

Anyway, it's sad for the players if it's an honest mistake. But it's down right pathetic when adults try to manipulate things.

[Unregistered]

Did the club knowingly cheat, or did a player pull a fast one, or did someone screw up, or what?

I've seen more than a few BU11 clubs with some players that looked like teens on them (i.e. obvious signs of puberty from kids who are allegedly in fifth grade). Which doesn't mean the clubs were cheating, obviously--some kids are early bloomers, physically--but a reputable club will play kids like that up an age group (as much as allowed).

"kids like that"

no bias on your part what so ever-you mix in comments such as "looked like teens" with "obvious signs of puberty" with "who are allegedly in fifth grade,"

I understand your intention to try to be diplomatic in your statement but perhaps you should have simply stuck to just asking the question.

I'm not sure what happened in this situation but I can tell you what happened to us before a game quite a few years ago. The refs were checking the cards before the game-Check in is different now. The ref looked at one player's card and said, "I know such and such, and you are not him." He took the card That team's games previously and yet to be played were forfeited and heavy fines issued. It was a nightmare and a lot protests filed.

[Unregistered]

To the extent they can, physically advanced kids SHOULD play up

"kids like that"

no bias on your part what so ever-you mix in comments such as "looked like teens" with "obvious signs of puberty" with "who are allegedly in fifth grade,"

I understand your intention to try to be diplomatic in your statement but perhaps you should have simply stuck to just asking the question.

I'm not sure what happened in this situation but I can tell you what happened to us before a game quite a few years ago. The refs were checking the cards before the game-Check in is different now. The ref looked at one player's card and said, "I know such and such, and you are not him." He took the card That team's games previously and yet to be played were forfeited and heavy fines issued. It was a nightmare and a lot protests filed.

In one specific case, I saw a U11 goalie who could touch his head to the crossbar, and when he spoke, spoke with the squeaky tenor of my 9th grader. Not saying he wasn't a legit U11--this was a "respectable" club that would have much to lose if caught cheating--but dayum, he was a head bigger than anyone else on the pitch.

The club we play for has a U11 centerback who is taller than I am. (And this is a kid I know, and whose age I can vouch for). He's a good player who hit a growth spurt in the past year, but in the words of Senator Sanders, he's YUGE.

My point is that kids that are physically advanced for their age... probably are best served playing up. And I have seen quite a few U11 teams where the entire roster looked like they were in middle school. (And to defuse the racial angle someone injected above--several of these were suburban clubs with lots of white players).

Quite a few trophy-hunting clubs, unfortunately, stack their A teams with the biggest, fastest, most physically-developed kids they can find within the age group. Such teams do well, until they run into a highly technically-skilled team, when they get picked apart--no kid can outrun a well-passed ball. If the goal is simply to win games and not develop players, this might be a sound way to do it--but if the goal is to make the players improve, players need to be placed in situations in which they can't simply physically dominate the game.

As far as the game you mention--was the kid indeed using a forged player card, or was the ref mistaken? If the latter, I would expect presentation of paperwork would resolve the issue. If the former, then the club got what they deserved. (If anything, OYSA should take a harder line on this sort of thing and blacklist coaches and DoCs who are discovered to be cheating, particularly repeat offenders).

[Unregistered]

In one specific case, I saw a U11 goalie who could touch his head to the crossbar, and when he spoke, spoke with the squeaky tenor of my 9th grader. Not saying he wasn't a legit U11--this was a "respectable" club that would have much to lose if caught cheating--but dayum, he was a head bigger than anyone else on the pitch.

The club we play for has a U11 centerback who is taller than I am. (And this is a kid I know, and whose age I can vouch for). He's a good player who hit a growth spurt in the past year, but in the words of Senator Sanders, he's YUGE.

My point is that kids that are physically advanced for their age... probably are best served playing up. And I have seen quite a few U11 teams where the entire roster looked like they were in middle school. (And to defuse the racial angle someone injected above--several of these were suburban clubs with lots of white players).

Quite a few trophy-hunting clubs, unfortunately, stack their A teams with the biggest, fastest, most physically-developed kids they can find within the age group. Such teams do well, until they run into a highly technically-skilled team, when they get picked apart--no kid can outrun a well-passed ball. If the goal is simply to win games and not develop players, this might be a sound way to do it--but if the goal is to make the players improve, players need to be placed in situations in which they can't simply physically dominate the game.

As far as the game you mention--was the kid indeed using a forged player card, or was the ref mistaken? If the latter, I would expect presentation of paperwork would resolve the issue. If the former, then the club got what they deserved. (If anything, OYSA should take a harder line on this sort of thing and blacklist coaches and DoCs who are discovered to be cheating, particularly repeat offenders).

Sizes can range all over the place in middle school no doubt, but a ten year old being that tall would be very unusual. A few years back we had a very tall player (legit) who was always getting questioned - I remember a guy claiming to be a doctor yelling nonstop "I'm a doctor. There's no way that kid is 12!"

[Unregistered]

Sizes can range all over the place in middle school no doubt, but a ten year old being that tall would be very unusual. A few years back we had a very tall player (legit) who was always getting questioned - I remember a guy claiming to be a doctor yelling nonstop "I'm a doctor. There's no way that kid is 12!"

We had that happen to a girl on our team, one of the moms kept yelling check her birth certificate. It was u11, very embarrassing for a girl. I don't think the mom understood that it was a summer tournament and her team was playing up a year, so she was a year older. Maybe the coach should have warned the moms that there might be bigger players.

Anyway we have seen more than a few that looked older. That is why there are bc checks.

[Unregistered]

We had that happen to a girl on our team, one of the moms kept yelling check her birth certificate. It was u11, very embarrassing for a girl. I don't think the mom understood that it was a summer tournament and her team was playing up a year, so she was a year older. Maybe the coach should have warned the moms that there might be bigger players.

Anyway we have seen more than a few that looked older. That is why there are bc checks.

I've got an early blooming giant and beleive me the kids hear those comments. Parents are much louder than they realize on the sidelines

[Unregistered]

I've got an early blooming giant and beleive me the kids hear those comments. Parents are much louder than they realize on the sidelines

If you have played out of state you see a lot of giants and get used to it.

[Unregistered]

In one specific case, I saw a U11 goalie who could touch his head to the crossbar, and when he spoke, spoke with the squeaky tenor of my 9th grader. Not saying he wasn't a legit U11--this was a "respectable" club that would have much to lose if caught cheating--but dayum, he was a head bigger than anyone else on the pitch.

The club we play for has a U11 centerback who is taller than I am. (And this is a kid I know, and whose age I can vouch for). He's a good player who hit a growth spurt in the past year, but in the words of Senator Sanders, he's YUGE.

My point is that kids that are physically advanced for their age... probably are best served playing up. And I have seen quite a few U11 teams where the entire roster looked like they were in middle school. (And to defuse the racial angle someone injected above--several of these were suburban clubs with lots of white players).

Quite a few trophy-hunting clubs, unfortunately, stack their A teams with the biggest, fastest, most physically-developed kids they can find within the age group. Such teams do well, until they run into a highly technically-skilled team, when they get picked apart--no kid can outrun a well-passed ball. If the goal is simply to win games and not develop players, this might be a sound way to do it--but if the goal is to make the players improve, players need to be placed in situations in which they can't simply physically dominate the game.

As far as the game you mention--was the kid indeed using a forged player card, or was the ref mistaken? If the latter, I would expect presentation of paperwork would resolve the issue. If the former, then the club got what they deserved. (If anything, OYSA should take a harder line on this sort of thing and blacklist coaches and DoCs who are discovered to be cheating, particularly repeat offenders).

My son was 5'7" by age 11 and played flank and keeper on his team. By the time he graduated from high school he was 6'4" and grew another 1" when he was 19. My family is tall. His team had player changes throughout the years but always the majority had size, height, speed, technical and tactical skills. They were extremely successful and many went on to full four year collegiate soccer experiences. A lot of them did benefit from playing ODP and on men's teams as well so they played under quite a bit of different scenarios growing up.

The kid I mentioned was actually using his younger brother's card for this particular game. The same ref told all of us(coaches, ARs) that he knew the boys and their family, and that he had reffed other games plenty of times. The truth eventually came out.

I always tell parents and players that the coaching and reffing communities are small communities. They've been around awhile and they see a lot of people. Refs know the players, coaches, and often times, they know a lot of managers and parents-I've even caught up with some of them when they've signed up to ref games at Surf Cup and tournaments in Canada.

[Unregistered]

By the time your kid is U13, you just get used to the fact that the kids have all grown at different rates and there is no way to tell age by size. I just trust that parents and coaches wouldn't put an older kid onto a younger team. Some kids who are U13 haven't grown much since U11, others have shot up 6" and put on 50 lbs. My U11 dd played against girls who had their period already. They were as tall as my wife. We have so many hormones in our food production that can help to accelerate what mother nature is already doing. So next time you feel the need to say "check their birth certificate", don't. Just whisper it to the parent next to you. Kids are pretty self conscience, especially when you are a large outlier.

[Unregistered]

By the time your kid is U13, you just get used to the fact that the kids have all grown at different rates and there is no way to tell age by size. I just trust that parents and coaches wouldn't put an older kid onto a younger team. Some kids who are U13 haven't grown much since U11, others have shot up 6" and put on 50 lbs. My U11 dd played against girls who had their period already. They were as tall as my wife. We have so many hormones in our food production that can help to accelerate what mother nature is already doing. So next time you feel the need to say "check their birth certificate", don't. Just whisper it to the parent next to you. Kids are pretty self conscience, especially when you are a large outlier.

Before anyone scoffs with your hormones in food production comment I wanted to share something I read in the early 80s about studies by UK researchers: They were predicting that hormones in milk served to our children in school had the potential to lead to earlier puberty rates over the next thirty years. Here we are and I still think about that brief article.

People with loud voices and no filters create tomorrow's loud voices with no filters. Sadly, they are likely proud of it too.

[Unregistered]

In fall last year we were playing a team (BU12) where a player had been sent off in their previous weekend's game for violent conduct (and rec'd a 2-game ban). When I get the game roster the opponent only had 10 players rostered, but they had 14 on the bench. I happened to remember the two-game ban. During 1/2 time coach asked the head ref to see the opposition's roster for write ins. Sure enough there were 4 names written in, one being the boy who was on a ban. The ref said he didn't have any info on the ban at the time, and when it was brought it up to OYSA it was ignored. So I guess it works most of the time.

[Unregistered]

Before anyone scoffs with your hormones in food production comment I wanted to share something I read in the early 80s about studies by UK researchers: They were predicting that hormones in milk served to our children in school had the potential to lead to earlier puberty rates over the next thirty years. Here we are and I still think about that brief article.

People with loud voices and no filters create tomorrow's loud voices with no filters. Sadly, they are likely proud of it too.

I'm the one who wrote about the hormones. Thank you for backing me up on this. You live in reality. There are recent studies that imply that this is exactly what is happening. Now it's difficult to tell if some early bloomer was impacted by hormones so they grew up two years earlier than they would have. Human bodies are complex and each one is unique and is programmed uniquely. Hormones in milk might impact some kids more than others. It could be impacting all kids a little and the reason some kids grow much earlier than others is just due to their programming.

[Unregistered]

In fall last year we were playing a team (BU12) where a player had been sent off in their previous weekend's game for violent conduct (and rec'd a 2-game ban). When I get the game roster the opponent only had 10 players rostered, but they had 14 on the bench. I happened to remember the two-game ban. During 1/2 time coach asked the head ref to see the opposition's roster for write ins. Sure enough there were 4 names written in, one being the boy who was on a ban. The ref said he didn't have any info on the ban at the time, and when it was brought it up to OYSA it was ignored. So I guess it works most of the time.

Shows hows times have changed with changing of the guard.

It used to be that you had until a certain date in the beginning of a league to write in so many names AND they had to be double-checked with player cards. Then they stopped using the player cards.