Thorns Academy $7,000 + a yearr

[Unregistered]

Nothing I've seen from PDX ECNL yet has convinced me that it is worth the money they are stating it will cost.

I think you are contradicting YOURSELF. On one hand you say we don't know and shouldn't make assumptions and then you close with that sentence. Exactly what were you saying about logic?

[Unregistered]

Simple solutions:

For those who can't afford it, stay away, it's not for you.
For those with daughters who are not in the top 10%, fuhgeddaboudit !
For those who believe you can achieve the same level of college exposure elsewhere for less money, ECNL is not for you.

Simple solutions are not the mindset of Oregon soccer parents.

They thrive on conflict and divisiveness creating a lot of disagreement between people and causing them to separate into different alienated groups.
No wonder youth soccer in this state is FUBAR.

[Unregistered]

You are MISSING the point of the thread

Simple solutions are not the mindset of Oregon soccer parents.

They thrive on conflict and divisiveness creating a lot of disagreement between people and causing them to separate into different alienated groups.
No wonder youth soccer in this state is FUBAR.

I agree with what you both said however the POINT of this thread is to call out the Timbers for giving PDX families FALSE hope.

They owe it to all of us to spell out what the Academy is or is not so that we can make an INFORMED choice.

Is that too much to ask from a supposedly "professional" organization committed to youth soccer?

[Unregistered]

I think you are contradicting YOURSELF. On one hand you say we don't know and shouldn't make assumptions and then you close with that sentence. Exactly what were you saying about logic?

I shouldn't argue with teenagers, but here goes. That is perfect logic. I am stating a fact that "I haven't seen anything yet that says it will be worth the money". That's a fact. I've seen the results of the teams in playing NWCL and out of state tournaments and the results were underwhelming. I know the coaches, and I am underwhelmed. I watched Fraser wave his arms and try to make a presentation, and that was underwhelming. And I've dealt with LO and Fraser and was extremely underwhelmed. Mybe the FC presentation will give me more hope. But my statement is perfectly logical. Other people may say they are overwhelmed by what they have seen and think it WILL be worth the money. That too is a logical statement. Ok there sparky, now do you get it?

[Unregistered]

To be clear

I shouldn't argue with teenagers, but here goes. That is perfect logic. I am stating a fact that "I haven't seen anything yet that says it will be worth the money". That's a fact. I've seen the results of the teams in playing NWCL and out of state tournaments and the results were underwhelming. I know the coaches, and I am underwhelmed. I watched Fraser wave his arms and try to make a presentation, and that was underwhelming. And I've dealt with LO and Fraser and was extremely underwhelmed. Mybe the FC presentation will give me more hope. But my statement is perfectly logical. Other people may say they are overwhelmed by what they have seen and think it WILL be worth the money. That too is a logical statement. Ok there sparky, now do you get it?

In other words without knowing who is going to be on the team or how good they may be or how they will stack up against the competition it looks like "uncertainty" and your dislike of Fraser and his coaching style are what you are calling "logic". Why don't just come out and say you don't like Fraser? Then admit he is not coaching ALL the teams rather than make a blanket statement about the ECNL teams from CU? I would respect you more if you were just honest about that.

I would then ask is that your opinion of all of the CU coaches?

Finally I would ask that you disclose who your DD's coach is now so we can compare!

[Unregistered]

In other words without knowing who is going to be on the team or how good they may be or how they will stack up against the competition it looks like "uncertainty" and your dislike of Fraser and his coaching style are what you are calling "logic". Why don't just come out and say you don't like Fraser? Then admit he is not coaching ALL the teams rather than make a blanket statement about the ECNL teams from CU? I would respect you more if you were just honest about that.

I would then ask is that your opinion of all of the CU coaches?

Finally I would ask that you disclose who your DD's coach is now so we can compare!

Based upon what I see today, that is my opinion. Now if ALL of the top girls go to one team, then my opinion might change. But as of today, what I have seen, I am underwhelmed. I am basing my opinion on complete information known today. Just like the stock market, where prices reflect the value of the information that investors know today. Tomorrow, new information may come out that changes that value. I can't believe that this is a difficult concept for you to understand, but apparently it is.

Don't worry about our coach, it's a great name and one that people respect. People would not question why we are with this coach.

And I don't care about all of the CU coaches, only the one that my dd will have. Every other coach at CU might be fantastic, but that does us no good if we don't like the one we are getting.

I'm not trying to tell everyone else how to think or feel. You can all vote with your wallet as it won't cost or benefit me what you do. This is my opinion based on what I know today.

[Unregistered]

I shouldn't argue with teenagers, but here goes. That is perfect logic. I am stating a fact that "I haven't seen anything yet that says it will be worth the money". That's a fact. I've seen the results of the teams in playing NWCL and out of state tournaments and the results were underwhelming. I know the coaches, and I am underwhelmed. I watched Fraser wave his arms and try to make a presentation, and that was underwhelming. And I've dealt with LO and Fraser and was extremely underwhelmed. Mybe the FC presentation will give me more hope. But my statement is perfectly logical. Other people may say they are overwhelmed by what they have seen and think it WILL be worth the money. That too is a logical statement. Ok there sparky, now do you get it?

We got it. Now you have decided....move along and enjoy your daughters experience outside of ECNL with your fantastic coach and world-class team. Best of luck to you.

[Unregistered]

We got it. Now you have decided....move along and enjoy your daughters experience outside of ECNL with your fantastic coach and world-class team. Best of luck to you.

You ECNL lovers sure are an odd lot. If someone says they aren't going to do it, and then list the reasons, you seem to take it as a personal affront. The people who choose to not do it aren't any more right or wrong than those who choose to do it. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It's so funny, someone says they aren't going to do it and then they get attacked for using bad logic. So they defend that logic and then you come along and bash them. Such an odd, odd lot of people you folks are.

[Unregistered]

Based upon what I see today, that is my opinion. Now if ALL of the top girls go to one team, then my opinion might change. But as of today, what I have seen, I am underwhelmed. I am basing my opinion on complete information known today. Just like the stock market, where prices reflect the value of the information that investors know today. Tomorrow, new information may come out that changes that value. I can't believe that this is a difficult concept for you to understand, but apparently it is.

Don't worry about our coach, it's a great name and one that people respect. People would not question why we are with this coach.

And I don't care about all of the CU coaches, only the one that my dd will have. Every other coach at CU might be fantastic, but that does us no good if we don't like the one we are getting.

I'm not trying to tell everyone else how to think or feel. You can all vote with your wallet as it won't cost or benefit me what you do. This is my opinion based on what I know today.

Sounds like your "anonymous" coach is perfect. You're fortunate to have the "nameless" coach for your daughter. I'm sure Frazer speaks highly of your "unidentified" coach.

[Unregistered]

You ECNL lovers sure are an odd lot. If someone says they aren't going to do it, and then list the reasons, you seem to take it as a personal affront. The people who choose to not do it aren't any more right or wrong than those who choose to do it. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It's so funny, someone says they aren't going to do it and then they get attacked for using bad logic. So they defend that logic and then you come along and bash them. Such an odd, odd lot of people you folks are.

Yes, ALL people responding who are not doing ECNL are above reproach and kind in their assessment. ALL people for ECNL are classless and bashers. Your posting shows you are not being honest.

Let's ALL agree that classless bashers exist on both sides of this discussion. It would be great if all discussions in this forum would become more civil.

[Unregistered]

I'm only going to give FM

Based upon what I see today, that is my opinion. Now if ALL of the top girls go to one team, then my opinion might change. But as of today, what I have seen, I am underwhelmed. I am basing my opinion on complete information known today. Just like the stock market, where prices reflect the value of the information that investors know today. Tomorrow, new information may come out that changes that value. I can't believe that this is a difficult concept for you to understand, but apparently it is.

Don't worry about our coach, it's a great name and one that people respect. People would not question why we are with this coach.

And I don't care about all of the CU coaches, only the one that my dd will have. Every other coach at CU might be fantastic, but that does us no good if we don't like the one we are getting.

I'm not trying to tell everyone else how to think or feel. You can all vote with your wallet as it won't cost or benefit me what you do. This is my opinion based on what I know today.

I'm chuckling about how you are "projecting" with less than complete information, I'll give you your concerns about FM as I too think he could have selected a better coach from within OR Xfire.

However I'm having a hard time with your prejudgment of the teams and why THAT "unknown" would preclude you from having your DD at least try out. Do you dog GM or Ford for what next years models are going to look like when they tell you there are going to be big changes without seeing them FIRST?

I get that you might not want to commit to CU this early but I would think that if your DD is one of the top 6 at her position in the area she should at least tryout and see who is going to be on the team. She can always tell them she wants to wait. I doubt that the older ages are going to have more than 20 qualified players so in theory you could wait and take your pick after the FC tryouts. Hell the mythical Thorns Academy might materialize this summer and that might be the best choice but why not keep your options open?

IMHO to prejudge anything beyond Fraser is unfair to your DD.

[Unregistered]

Sounds like your "anonymous" coach is perfect. You're fortunate to have the "nameless" coach for your daughter. I'm sure Frazer speaks highly of your "unidentified" coach.

I'm not talking about Faser (you mispelled his name) as a coach. I'm talking about him being in charge of CU ECNL. He seemed to be the guy running the effort.

[Unregistered]

Only for the presentation.

I'm not talking about Faser (you mispelled his name) as a coach. I'm talking about him being in charge of CU ECNL. He seemed to be the guy running the effort.

TA is the Executive Director for the CU effort. He shares share responsibilities with FM for staffing the coaches for the teams but TA is the point person for CU & ECNL.

[Unregistered]

I'm chuckling about how you are "projecting" with less than complete information, I'll give you your concerns about FM as I too think he could have selected a better coach from within OR Xfire.

However I'm having a hard time with your prejudgment of the teams and why THAT "unknown" would preclude you from having your DD at least try out. Do you dog GM or Ford for what next years models are going to look like when they tell you there are going to be big changes without seeing them FIRST?

I get that you might not want to commit to CU this early but I would think that if your DD is one of the top 6 at her position in the area she should at least tryout and see who is going to be on the team. She can always tell them she wants to wait. I doubt that the older ages are going to have more than 20 qualified players so in theory you could wait and take your pick after the FC tryouts. Hell the mythical Thorns Academy might materialize this summer and that might be the best choice but why not keep your options open?

IMHO to prejudge anything beyond Fraser is unfair to your DD.

It's a valid point. And I didn't say she won't try out. Please reread. I'm saying that as of now, I'm underwhelmed. And given the existing teams that are the basis for this team, I am underwhelmed. Now you are right, who knows who might show up. I was clear in saying that I am basing my opinion on information that I know now. In the future, there will be more information that will change my opinion, perhaps make my perception better or worse. Going to tryouts will be good for information. Both to see the coaching and to see the players trying out. But realize, tryouts will likely occur at the same time for both ECNL teams and for the Academy (assuming it comes to fruition). If all of the top girls tryout for all three things, they will likely make all three teams and then the fun starts. Who is going where? You could end up with one great team, one good team and one team that is not good. Or three semi-good teams. Or two good teams and one not good one. And will we know who is on what team before committing? It's a chicken and egg question. If a person is on a very good team at the moment, and that team can stay together, it probably makes more sense to stick with that. Take the risk out of the equation. Let ECNL and the Academy sort through this for a year and then pick the best team after that.

[Unregistered]

It's a valid point. And I didn't say she won't try out. Please reread. I'm saying that as of now, I'm underwhelmed. And given the existing teams that are the basis for this team, I am underwhelmed. Now you are right, who knows who might show up. I was clear in saying that I am basing my opinion on information that I know now. In the future, there will be more information that will change my opinion, perhaps make my perception better or worse. Going to tryouts will be good for information. Both to see the coaching and to see the players trying out. But realize, tryouts will likely occur at the same time for both ECNL teams and for the Academy (assuming it comes to fruition). If all of the top girls tryout for all three things, they will likely make all three teams and then the fun starts. Who is going where? You could end up with one great team, one good team and one team that is not good. Or three semi-good teams. Or two good teams and one not good one. And will we know who is on what team before committing? It's a chicken and egg question. If a person is on a very good team at the moment, and that team can stay together, it probably makes more sense to stick with that. Take the risk out of the equation. Let ECNL and the Academy sort through this for a year and then pick the best team after that.

ECNL tryouts at CU are scheduled for 6/24, 6/26/, 7/8 & 7/10.... starting in 19 days.
If the Timbers are serious about their Thorns Academy, now's the time to get the word out.