2013 Boys Soccer Verbal Commitments

[Unregistered]

There is a big difference between playing for the experience of it all and pursuing the high level track like DAP/ECNL. For the former all it really takes is a high school team and a cohesive/ sustainable MAPLE team. No travel. No big expenses. It's just for fun. Doubt anyone argues that one. The latter is really what the discussion is all about. Being on the college scholarship hunt is a huge commitment not only in terms of money but time and energy as well. The crux of this most recent discussion about commitments and cost is far connected than some want to acknowledge. Anyone who is ending up on a commitment list is not getting there by going the "fun route". Unfortunately the discussion about commitments envariably boils down to one about whether the end justified the means. It sux because it does unfairly put the kid in the bullseye but if you are going to put them up as an example of what might be possible like the one poster admitted to doing they really need to fill in the blanks to complete the picture. Let's face it if a parent spent 70-80k during the youth soccer years and their kid ended up as a practice player as many of the players on these lists do the accomplishment some people are trying posture did not actually happen. That is why these commitment threads suck. They do nothing but set false expectations and injure the innocent along the way.

Agree that there's a big difference between playing for the experience and playing for financially-justified outcomes. What gets lost on this site is that most, like around 90% for boys from the numbers cited, are playing for the experience. And the posts on this site can help people contemplating club soccer realize some of the facts, about the real costs involved and the real numbers about how many are in it because of college goals and how many are in it without college-related potential. Disagree that this discussion is only about the 10's of kids playing DAP/ECNL; suggest it's broader and includes anyone making the commitment to clubs.

[Unregistered]

Agree that there's a big difference between playing for the experience and playing for financially-justified outcomes. What gets lost on this site is that most, like around 90% for boys from the numbers cited, are playing for the experience. And the posts on this site can help people contemplating club soccer realize some of the facts, about the real costs involved and the real numbers about how many are in it because of college goals and how many are in it without college-related potential. Disagree that this discussion is only about the 10's of kids playing DAP/ECNL; suggest it's broader and includes anyone making the commitment to clubs.

Isn't that the point of the discussion. If you are in it for fun, why in god's name would you spend the sort of money that is being thrown around? Most suspect those that do spend and claim it is only for fun are just fooling themselves. The fact that there are so few players that get any sort of scholarship money and so many spending big money suggests that there is monstrous disconnect on expectations.

[Unregistered]

Isn't that the point of the discussion. If you are in it for fun, why in god's name would you spend the sort of money that is being thrown around? Most suspect those that do spend and claim it is only for fun are just fooling themselves. The fact that there are so few players that get any sort of scholarship money and so many spending big money suggests that there is monstrous disconnect on expectations.

How about the simple love of good competition. Town teams charge money! While I agree they don't charge nearly the same amount, we can both agree the quality of play is far below that of club. In this day and age, the love of a sport is not the same as when we were kids. You simply can't just show up at the park and find a pick up game.

[Unregistered]

Amazing how this turned into a totally different thread from the original.

[Unregistered]

Amazing how this turned into a totally different thread from the original.

OP here. Tell me about it. You got a fire hose I could use? It's going to be slower this year getting names because the ESPN site is down, and the others aren't as good. So at least this chatter is keeping the thread on the front page.

[dd2]

Maybe I'm a pollyanna, but I don't think that the kids on these commitment lists got there because they decided to play soccer strictly to get college scholarships or admissions assistance. Sure, those motivations may have played a role at some point, but the kids I have known over the years who have committed, especially at the D1 level, are generally kids who love the game and want to play it at the highest level they can. They know they may not play a lot at the next level, but they want to give it a go.

The ones I know often started in the town programs at U8 or 9, having fun and running around with their friends. By U10 or 12, it was reasonably apparent that they were "good" at the game. Some were superstars, others just pretty good compared to their peers. Regardless, their participation in the game snowballed. They started getting interested in higher level competition. They joined club teams. They started training more.

Of course, their parents funded these activities. Why did the parents do it? Probably because they loved their children and saw something constructive in playing a sport and getting good at it. Fortunately, these parents were either wealthy enough to pick up the tab or their kids were good enough that the clubs offered financial assistance. Did the parents understand that there might be a "payoff" down the road? Probably yes, but I don't think that parents or players could have gone down this road successfully unless the child loved the game and would have played regardless. indeed, at U12 or 14, what kid really understands what college admissions is all about?

By U16 or so, the "just for the fun of it" may have faded as the mercenary aspects increased. With recruitment, ID camps, DAP, ECNL etc., it's hard not to know that a player's skill could pay off. So by this time, I think that both players and parents began behaving strategically. Sure, it was still important to have fun in the game, but playing on the right teams, getting seen at tournaments, etc. became important. And once again, most of these players had parents who could foot the bill or were good enough to get financial help.

So how did it all work out? I'd say a pretty high percentage of the kids I know in "high level" soccer (maybe 60-65%?) got some kind of payoff, either in a D1 scholarship or admissions boost at an Ivy or D3 school (where there are no scholarships). I seriously doubt that any "made money" given how much was spent over the years. Nevertheless, I don't think that any of their parents regrets the money they spent. Even for those who did not get recruited, I have not heard a great deal of bitterness. Disappointment if their child wanted to play in college but might not? Sure. But not outright bitterness, because I think most of those parents see their kid's soccer experience as a constructive, fun "adventure" in which they got to share.

From my perspective, the effort and money spent in youth soccer isn't all that different from dance, music, theater, or whatever other extracurriculars a kid gets really good at. Piano lessons from a top teacher easily run $100 an hour. At one per week, that's $5200 per year, leaving aside music camps, ensembles, etc. There aren't music scholarships that look anything like D1 athletic scholarships, nor does music help in admissions like sports recruiting does. Yet parents gladly spend the money just like soccer parents do, simply to give their children a chance to pursue something they enjoy and for the lessons that endeavor teaches. Is the money worth it? That's something each parent has to answer on his own.

I will say this, though. Being a recruited athlete, even without money, is a very privileged way to get into college. To know, often before you start your senior year, that you are pretty much set for college is a huge benefit. If you've had a kid who isn't a recruited athlete sweat through early decision only to be deferred or rejected, then writing essays like mad by January 1, and then wondering what will happen in April, you'll know what I mean. Personally, I don't think that athletes deserve this kind of special treatment, but they get it. And because that's the way the world is, I can see why so many parents will spend money on activities where, if it just works out, their children can enjoy the same privilege.

[Unregistered]

I can see one fundamental problem in the US. My older son grew up playing youth soccer in Europe. My younger one did so in MA. Town programs I saw in Europe were inexpensive, but you could really learn the game well there because most adults, especially the coaches, know the sport, and all the kids coming out watch the game and have already learned a lot before they start. It's ingrained in the culture. US town programs mostly cannot offer that. In fact in most cases, you pick up some bad habits. So if you want to really learn how to play well here, you have to find some type of professional help.

[Unregistered]

OP here. Tell me about it. You got a fire hose I could use? It's going to be slower this year getting names because the ESPN site is down, and the others aren't as good. So at least this chatter is keeping the thread on the front page.

How much will the hose cost??
It is reasonable to combine the topics from the original listings to what it takes to get there. It is a fact that getting to many of these schools is not solely related to soccer. It is also of interest to realize that only a minority of youth players get to play at a significant Division 1 school, and even fewer ever go pro. Therefore it is reasonable to ask how much was invested and whether or not it gave a leg up....so to speak.

I think it is increasingly recognized that the DAP players are getting looks from college coaches....more than non-DAP players on average. What is more significant is that the average DAP player will play 'only' about 5,000 dollars for the year. This is about 50% of the price of other top boys clubs i.e. Blazers.

When considering where these kids go to college and what is invested, there is justification for trying to play DAP, however, there has to be less expensive options than clubs like the Blazers which will run about 10,000+ per year.

[Unregistered]

Maybe I'm a pollyanna, but I don't think that the kids on these commitment lists got there because they decided to play soccer strictly to get college scholarships or admissions assistance. Sure, those motivations may have played a role at some point, but the kids I have known over the years who have committed, especially at the D1 level, are generally kids who love the game and want to play it at the highest level they can. They know they may not play a lot at the next level, but they want to give it a go.

The ones I know often started in the town programs at U8 or 9, having fun and running around with their friends. By U10 or 12, it was reasonably apparent that they were "good" at the game. Some were superstars, others just pretty good compared to their peers. Regardless, their participation in the game snowballed. They started getting interested in higher level competition. They joined club teams. They started training more.

Of course, their parents funded these activities. Why did the parents do it? Probably because they loved their children and saw something constructive in playing a sport and getting good at it. Fortunately, these parents were either wealthy enough to pick up the tab or their kids were good enough that the clubs offered financial assistance. Did the parents understand that there might be a "payoff" down the road? Probably yes, but I don't think that parents or players could have gone down this road successfully unless the child loved the game and would have played regardless. indeed, at U12 or 14, what kid really understands what college admissions is all about?

By U16 or so, the "just for the fun of it" may have faded as the mercenary aspects increased. With recruitment, ID camps, DAP, ECNL etc., it's hard not to know that a player's skill could pay off. So by this time, I think that both players and parents began behaving strategically. Sure, it was still important to have fun in the game, but playing on the right teams, getting seen at tournaments, etc. became important. And once again, most of these players had parents who could foot the bill or were good enough to get financial help.

So how did it all work out? I'd say a pretty high percentage of the kids I know in "high level" soccer (maybe 60-65%?) got some kind of payoff, either in a D1 scholarship or admissions boost at an Ivy or D3 school (where there are no scholarships). I seriously doubt that any "made money" given how much was spent over the years. Nevertheless, I don't think that any of their parents regrets the money they spent. Even for those who did not get recruited, I have not heard a great deal of bitterness. Disappointment if their child wanted to play in college but might not? Sure. But not outright bitterness, because I think most of those parents see their kid's soccer experience as a constructive, fun "adventure" in which they got to share.

From my perspective, the effort and money spent in youth soccer isn't all that different from dance, music, theater, or whatever other extracurriculars a kid gets really good at. Piano lessons from a top teacher easily run $100 an hour. At one per week, that's $5200 per year, leaving aside music camps, ensembles, etc. There aren't music scholarships that look anything like D1 athletic scholarships, nor does music help in admissions like sports recruiting does. Yet parents gladly spend the money just like soccer parents do, simply to give their children a chance to pursue something they enjoy and for the lessons that endeavor teaches. Is the money worth it? That's something each parent has to answer on his own.

I will say this, though. Being a recruited athlete, even without money, is a very privileged way to get into college. To know, often before you start your senior year, that you are pretty much set for college is a huge benefit. If you've had a kid who isn't a recruited athlete sweat through early decision only to be deferred or rejected, then writing essays like mad by January 1, and then wondering what will happen in April, you'll know what I mean. Personally, I don't think that athletes deserve this kind of special treatment, but they get it. And because that's the way the world is, I can see why so many parents will spend money on activities where, if it just works out, their children can enjoy the same privilege.

OMG! Thank you! Every single word, including the very last paragraph. Here is an intelligent person who is not trying to run an agenda down everyone's throat.

You are totally right about the lack of disappointment and lack of bitterness. And in those cases where kids don't make it in some sense (let's say any level of college soccer as the example), most aren't upset about the money spent, but rather they are simply disappointed that their kid wasn't as good as they hoped, and in many cases the kid probably also is disappointed. Accepting something less than you want is tough in all areas, not just soccer, and for most money at the end of the rainbow isn't the issue.

[Unregistered]

But seriously what is bc doing with the recruits they should have gotten jo by

[Unregistered]

But seriously what is bc doing with the recruits they should have gotten jo by

huh? this makes no sense.

[Unregistered]

How about the simple love of good competition. Town teams charge money! While I agree they don't charge nearly the same amount, we can both agree the quality of play is far below that of club. In this day and age, the love of a sport is not the same as when we were kids. You simply can't just show up at the park and find a pick up game.

All true. Not sure if are you trying to defend spending big money on soccer just to have fun or if you are really talking about simply finding a quality club team that has both modest cost and expectations. The profile that has people shaking their heads is the person involved with the Blazers or the Bolts who is saying that they are only in it for the experience. The point that strikes many is that is an over the top track to be on if your goal is actually that modest.

[Unregistered]

All true. Not sure if are you trying to defend spending big money on soccer just to have fun or if you are really talking about simply finding a quality club team that has both modest cost and expectations. The profile that has people shaking their heads is the person involved with the Blazers or the Bolts who is saying that they are only in it for the experience. The point that strikes many is that is an over the top track to be on if your goal is actually that modest.

The mentality of most participants in club soccer is to compete as much as they can at the highest level they can for as long as they can, until they don't enjoy it anymore. For some, that translates to trying to play in college after club, but it does not mean that getting a college admissions boost is the reason they're playing club. That 90% of club players don't play in college is good evidence that this is the case.

[Unregistered]

All true. Not sure if are you trying to defend spending big money on soccer just to have fun or if you are really talking about simply finding a quality club team that has both modest cost and expectations. The profile that has people shaking their heads is the person involved with the Blazers or the Bolts who is saying that they are only in it for the experience. The point that strikes many is that is an over the top track to be on if your goal is actually that modest.

You could argue this about virtually any hobby. There are people who pursue activities intially at entry level and pursue more intense participation as their skills and talent emerge. How many bicyclists started doing it for fun and now have $3000 bikes and travel the country doing road races? Tri atheletes, marathoners, scuba divers, skiiers, kayakers, sailors, etc, etc, etc. There are over 70 softball teams that play in huge national competitions with other like minded folks. No payoff is awaiting them.

Our sporting culture is based on people spending enormous time, money and passion pursuing meaningless (not to them) goals. Golfers spend thousands of hours trying to break 90, 80, etc. Lessons, new clubs, endless practice and the only payoff is personal satisfaction and maybe a few won side bets.

Many people like to push their limits, to compete at the highest level they can attain simply because it is a challenge and they find it fun and exciting. The fact that people cannot grasp this is driven by their own agenda.

[Unregistered]

You could argue this about virtually any hobby. There are people who pursue activities intially at entry level and pursue more intense participation as their skills and talent emerge. How many bicyclists started doing it for fun and now have $3000 bikes and travel the country doing road races? Tri atheletes, marathoners, scuba divers, skiiers, kayakers, sailors, etc, etc, etc. There are over 70 softball teams that play in huge national competitions with other like minded folks. No payoff is awaiting them.

Our sporting culture is based on people spending enormous time, money and passion pursuing meaningless (not to them) goals. Golfers spend thousands of hours trying to break 90, 80, etc. Lessons, new clubs, endless practice and the only payoff is personal satisfaction and maybe a few won side bets.

Many people like to push their limits, to compete at the highest level they can attain simply because it is a challenge and they find it fun and exciting. The fact that people cannot grasp this is driven by their own agenda.

Really good points. My kid has a desire to be challenged and I'm doing my best to make that happen. Do I have some vision they will be famous from it, nope. It's like my Golf hobby (easy 4k a year) or Fly fishing (1k a year) or boating (endless).

They are all things I enjoy and do with passion. My family enjoys them too so why not spend the time and money on it if I can? I cannot put a price on my 10 yr old fly fishing with me on the saco.