Needham Girls HS Hazing

[Unregistered]

People of certain religious and cultural backgrounds could have enormous issues with this. Please have an open mind and understand that your feelings do not necessarily define a cultural norm.

Oh boy, here we go! Now you are going to try and compare this to Abu Ghraib???

[Unregistered]

This is NOT a case of bullying. Bullying is defined as "repeated acts over time to create or enforce one group or person's power over another". Unless you have evidence that these kids have been picked on throughout the season, there is nothing that would make me think that this was anything more than a single incident. Should the seniors known better? Yes they should, but they are not adults, and unlikely to connect what they've learned about bullying to what they did in this incident. Why? Because I doubt they felt any animosity toward the freshman and only looked at it as a high school rite of passage. One could probably assume that the same was done to them as freshman and unless the school and coach have made a strong case against it in the past, there is no reason to assume that the adolescent brain thought what they were doing was harmful or anything more than a joke. I'm sure they and their classmates will all take hazing more seriously following the consequences of this behavior.

So in your view anyone under the age of 18 is an adolescent and doesn't have to take responsibility for their actions.

I also did not assert it happened before, but I am not so naive as to think that the first "hazing" of freshmen waits until the virtual end of the season at the beginning of November. I guess you know that on this team, this was the absolutely first time for any hazing, but I can assure you that on other teams hazing is a season-long ritual.

[Unregistered]

Oh boy, here we go! Now you are going to try and compare this to Abu Ghraib???

Well, everyone knows that putting pies in a person's face is a particularly cruel form of water-boarding.

[Unregistered]

at my school a girl was late to practice so the coach made her stand in front of the whole team as they proceeded to whip fifty or so soccer balls at her. those girls should be lucky they got pies.

Actually, no. It is your coach who is lucky he/she didn't get fired.

Why do people haze? Think about it. What does having freshmen girls in dog leashes getting hit in the face with a pie have to do with being better prepared to win a playoff game? I agree it is not criminal, but it is an act of outright stupidity by girls for no other reason than "well it was done to me". I would love for someone to answer that question - what was the point other than to humiliate them? The girls involved should have known better and known the consequences of hazing.

[Unregistered]

You really think this group of upperclassmen treated them like peers all season and just started hazing at the end of the season? If so, I have some land for sale I would like you to take a look at.....

See, unlike you, I don't make assumption. I have no idea how the upperclassmen treated the freshman. I have no idea what prompted a hazing incident late in the season. All I said is unless there is evidence of an ongoing case of bullying, please, don't turn this into something it isn't, namely a case of bullying. Do you have evidence that there were other incidents? If it remains at just this single incident, I don't think there is any need to worry about it being a "deeply humiliating" event with "lasting consequences".

[Unregistered]

Oh boy, here we go! Now you are going to try and compare this to Abu Ghraib???

No I am not. You are. Common rhetorical device to drag in something like Abu Ghraib so that one can minimize something else.

Were you one of the parents who went to court for your little Mia or are you someone just as insensitive? There are special schools filled with students who were driven there by this kind of behavior. The degree to which some target the victims as just not tough enough is disgusting.

[Unregistered]

For the people on here defending this as a simple prank, and stating that "hazing happens everywhere in America". First of all, you are wrong with statement #2. It is happening less and less because of the severity of incidents and the growth of things like Facebook where it is depicted and therefore caught. And second, please let me know when your son or daughter goes off to college and joins a team, frat, sorority, etc...let me know when you tell them "it's no big deal" to be hazed then. It is a practice that is conducted on a slippery slope and one that can quickly become dangerous.

A friend of mine joined a sorority at MCLA, then North Adams, in the 90's. One of the things the girls were made to do was go out into a mud puddle and swim and blow bubbles in it in front of the brother fraternity. One of the girls had a wig due to a rare condition that no one knew about, and wouldn't do it because of how expensive the wig was. I remember finding her crying in the bathroom and screaming, just flat out screaming, while the other girls were outside doing it. You never know what someone has been through and what a little "harmless" prank could bring about.

[Unregistered]

Is this something the college coach decides or is it admissions?

Reposting this one more time because it seems to respond to the issue of hazing without directly attacking the players or the coach.

[Unregistered]

So in your view anyone under the age of 18 is an adolescent and doesn't have to take responsibility for their actions.

I also did not assert it happened before, but I am not so naive as to think that the first "hazing" of freshmen waits until the virtual end of the season at the beginning of November. I guess you know that on this team, this was the absolutely first time for any hazing, but I can assure you that on other teams hazing is a season-long ritual.

Helloooo. Can you read? I have said more than once now that I thought the senior should be punished, but I know that the last part of the human brain to develop is the part responsible for making judgements and decisions so it comes as no surprise that even 18 year olds make bad decisions. My bigger issues are with the adults involved. The coach who apprently didn't deal with the incident when it first come to light. The parents who don't believe their children should stand up and face the music. But also adults, such as yourself, who want to over react and make this a case of bullying people of different cultures and religions.

Now I know for sure you are a Democrat.

[Unregistered]

Depends on the college, but it is probably the coach that would decide. If this is not criminal and just an athletic incident, admissions would never learn of it. The coach probably would though.

I believe schools have the responsibility to inform colleges of any disciplinary action taken against students during their HS years, particularly as seniors. That would include suspensions, expulsions, etc.

[Unregistered]

No I am not. You are. Common rhetorical device to drag in something like Abu Ghraib so that one can minimize something else.

Were you one of the parents who went to court for your little Mia or are you someone just as insensitive? There are special schools filled with students who were driven there by this kind of behavior. The degree to which some target the victims as just not tough enough is disgusting.

Huh? Didn't you just do what you accused me of?

No, I don't have kids that go to school in Needham. In fact, I don't even have kids that play soccer agains Needham High School, boys or girls.

As far as Abu Ghraib. what else should anyone connote from a comment "People of certain religious and cultural backgrounds could have enormous issues with this" when it comes to wearing a dog collar and leash? My only other thought would have to do with S&M, but that has nothing to do with religion, at least as far as I know.

[Unregistered]

every high school team in america participates in some sort of hazing. although your sons or daughters may not run home to tell their parents about it (as freshman or seniors) it still happens. just because this time the freshman ran home to tell on the big bag seniors they get suspended? its crazy that these poor girls would undergo such consequences for something that happens on every field, at every high school. when your kids in high school they should be able to man up and handle harmless pranks. im sure these girls weren't looking to harm any of the freshman involved, only to carry on the traditions that have gone on for years and years at their school. to think that these girl's futures are put in jeopardy just because a few freshman cant take a joke is ridiculous. grow up and man up .. very annoyed by all this crap.

You are a perfect example of why we have such issues. I bet you're a coach yourself and you get some high on being in power and watching girls feel disgraced and humiliated. You're very scary and ignorant.

[Unregistered]

Actually, no. It is your coach who is lucky he/she didn't get fired.

Why do people haze? Think about it. What does having freshmen girls in dog leashes getting hit in the face with a pie have to do with being better prepared to win a playoff game? I agree it is not criminal, but it is an act of outright stupidity by girls for no other reason than "well it was done to me". I would love for someone to answer that question - what was the point other than to humiliate them? The girls involved should have known better and known the consequences of hazing.

They should have, but obviously they didn't. What was the point other than to humiliate? That is not how most teenage brains work. They did not do this with the intent to humiliate. It's a big joke to them, one they were probably on the receiving end of at one time and took no offense to. Unless of course, someone has evidence that the freshmen were ongoing targets throughout the season.

[Unregistered]

this whole thing is hilarious. did you hear what they did? they were blind folded, put on dog leashes, and got a pie in the face. did someone seriously cry to their mommy and daddy... who then went and called the school. how old are you? now because of these six year olds five girls are being suspended, could get scholarships taken away, and might be criminally charged... over a pie in the face? is that a joke? this is stupid everyone is freaking out over nothing.

You're scary.

[Unregistered]

Helloooo. Can you read? I have said more than once now that I thought the senior should be punished, but I know that the last part of the human brain to develop is the part responsible for making judgements and decisions so it comes as no surprise that even 18 year olds make bad decisions. My bigger issues are with the adults involved. The coach who apprently didn't deal with the incident when it first come to light. The parents who don't believe their children should stand up and face the music. But also adults, such as yourself, who want to over react and make this a case of bullying people of different cultures and religions.

Now I know for sure you are a Democrat.

My comment about other cultures and religions was intended in the same vein as the one about the girl who wore a wig because of a medical condition. Both were in response to comments minimizing the possible impact of the actions. I think my point as well as the poster of the comment about the wig are saying that you really know so little about the psychological state and values of others that you have no business declaring that the impact is overstated. You have a right to say it about yourself, but no onbe else.

The fact that for some reason you feel the need to label me a Democrat shows that you like sharp lines and prefer to put people in boxes. I took the time to give you a thoughtful explanation of my comment. If you have any political poison sacs you need to drain, I suggest you take it to the politics thread. It is irrelevant in this thread and only reveals your ignorance.