jerk offs

[Unregistered]

I'm not a fan of the manager mentioned above, nor the club as a whole, but it would be a shame if the Hamlets fell apart. They've done a lot for the sport of soccer in Central Mass. I find it hard to believe that would happen though.

Pay no attention to the NEFC propaganda and hype machine. Find a club where you kid enjoys himself and isn't lied to in order to keep the checks coming in.

[Unregistered]

What comes around goes around.....this is easy enough to say but when it happens, it usually affects more than the initial jerk.

I have one issue and one question regarding this topic:
1. I have no doubt that getting your pants beat off you can be turned into a constructive opportunity and you get to see a coach be a coach and a parent be a parent. The kids may also stride to work harder as well. It is an opportunity to better yourselves. One can construct a benefit in getting beat badly.
2. Question: For what benefit/purpose is there to beat the pants off someone? How does the coach/club/team benefit from ripping a new a-hole into the opposing team? I really can't think of any. FO...DC....enlighten us with a response!!!

[Unregistered]

What comes around goes around.....this is easy enough to say but when it happens, it usually affects more than the initial jerk.

I have one issue and one question regarding this topic:
1. I have no doubt that getting your pants beat off you can be turned into a constructive opportunity and you get to see a coach be a coach and a parent be a parent. The kids may also stride to work harder as well. It is an opportunity to better yourselves. One can construct a benefit in getting beat badly.
2. Question: For what benefit/purpose is there to beat the pants off someone? How does the coach/club/team benefit from ripping a new a-hole into the opposing team? I really can't think of any. FO...DC....enlighten us with a response!!!

I'll take a stab at this one (not FO or DC by the way).

Here's one possible scenario that shows one potential benefit.

A couple of years ago, my daughter (U11 at the time) was on a very good team. In order to avoide the 16 - 0 type victories, the coach began playing better out of state competition, playing them up against older teams locally and sometimes older boys teams. Now granted, some of these teams were high school JV teams or other "B" club teams (U13/14), but older nonetheless.

Prior to one memorable game, parents and players from the opposing team were negatively commenting -- within earshot of my daughter's team -- "We shouldn't be playing these girls, we're going to crush them", "Look at how small they are", "What a waste of our time." and "Why do they even try. . . they don't have a chance." I'm sure you've all heard these types of comments. Very vocal and purposely said loudly to try to embarrass our girls.

This gave more than a little bit of a fire for our girls to "kick it up a knotch". They played with a little extra determination. In this particular game, I remember my daughter's team winning 11-0. It got to the point where the older players and parents were silenced and standing there with jaws dropped and nothing to say.

The benefit: Not only did our girls learn composure and to play in the face of negative comments and against much older, bigger players, but the older, bigger players (and parents) learned to be careful not to judge other teams by age or physical stature. I don't believe a 1-0 or even a 4-0 win would have accomplished what an 11-0 win did. You can't call an 11-0 game "lucky" or blame it on the refs. BOTH sides of this game learned a lesson that day.

This was one of many times where comments such as these before a game ended up being disproven. Over time, my daughter's team learned that "smack talk" and negativity shouldn't have any bearing on how you play. And I'm certain that many of the older teams (and boys teams!) and parents learned valuable lessons as well.

[Unregistered]

I'll take a stab at this one (not FO or DC by the way).

Here's one possible scenario that shows one potential benefit.

A couple of years ago, my daughter (U11 at the time) was on a very good team. In order to avoide the 16 - 0 type victories, the coach began playing better out of state competition, playing them up against older teams locally and sometimes older boys teams. Now granted, some of these teams were high school JV teams or other "B" club teams (U13/14), but older nonetheless.

Prior to one memorable game, parents and players from the opposing team were negatively commenting -- within earshot of my daughter's team -- "We shouldn't be playing these girls, we're going to crush them", "Look at how small they are", "What a waste of our time." and "Why do they even try. . . they don't have a chance." I'm sure you've all heard these types of comments. Very vocal and purposely said loudly to try to embarrass our girls.

This gave more than a little bit of a fire for our girls to "kick it up a knotch". They played with a little extra determination. In this particular game, I remember my daughter's team winning 11-0. It got to the point where the older players and parents were silenced and standing there with jaws dropped and nothing to say.

The benefit: Not only did our girls learn composure and to play in the face of negative comments and against much older, bigger players, but the older, bigger players (and parents) learned to be careful not to judge other teams by age or physical stature. I don't believe a 1-0 or even a 4-0 win would have accomplished what an 11-0 win did. You can't call an 11-0 game "lucky" or blame it on the refs. BOTH sides of this game learned a lesson that day.

This was one of many times where comments such as these before a game ended up being disproven. Over time, my daughter's team learned that "smack talk" and negativity shouldn't have any bearing on how you play. And I'm certain that many of the older teams (and boys teams!) and parents learned valuable lessons as well.

Nice story and while your U11's sound like they were indeed a strong group, their circumstance and how they handled it that particular day is not really on point. Once the Stars realized the circumstances with which they were presented with on Sunday, they should have made reasonable adjustments to minimize the run-up. Just my opinion I realize, but Stars vs. FH took place in fall MAPLE, which is decidedly different from an instance where a team of known strength seeks an appropriate challenge by playing up against older competition.

[Unregistered]

I'll take a stab at this one (not FO or DC by the way).

Here's one possible scenario that shows one potential benefit.

A couple of years ago, my daughter (U11 at the time) was on a very good team. In order to avoide the 16 - 0 type victories, the coach began playing better out of state competition, playing them up against older teams locally and sometimes older boys teams. Now granted, some of these teams were high school JV teams or other "B" club teams (U13/14), but older nonetheless.

Prior to one memorable game, parents and players from the opposing team were negatively commenting -- within earshot of my daughter's team -- "We shouldn't be playing these girls, we're going to crush them", "Look at how small they are", "What a waste of our time." and "Why do they even try. . . they don't have a chance." I'm sure you've all heard these types of comments. Very vocal and purposely said loudly to try to embarrass our girls.

This gave more than a little bit of a fire for our girls to "kick it up a knotch". They played with a little extra determination. In this particular game, I remember my daughter's team winning 11-0. It got to the point where the older players and parents were silenced and standing there with jaws dropped and nothing to say.

The benefit: Not only did our girls learn composure and to play in the face of negative comments and against much older, bigger players, but the older, bigger players (and parents) learned to be careful not to judge other teams by age or physical stature. I don't believe a 1-0 or even a 4-0 win would have accomplished what an 11-0 win did. You can't call an 11-0 game "lucky" or blame it on the refs. BOTH sides of this game learned a lesson that day.

This was one of many times where comments such as these before a game ended up being disproven. Over time, my daughter's team learned that "smack talk" and negativity shouldn't have any bearing on how you play. And I'm certain that many of the older teams (and boys teams!) and parents learned valuable lessons as well.

You are, to some extent, bringing up a very different issue. Your daughter's team was the underdog and the supposed better team was running with their mouths. This thread is more where the better team kicked the crap out of the lesser team.
Although you make a good point about keeping your mouths shut and not talking 'smack talk', you do realize that we are talking about different conditions.
This thread would be more similar to the older team kicking the crap out of your daughter's team....

[Unregistered]

You are, to some extent, bringing up a very different issue. Your daughter's team was the underdog and the supposed better team was running with their mouths. This thread is more where the better team kicked the crap out of the lesser team.
Although you make a good point about keeping your mouths shut and not talking 'smack talk', you do realize that we are talking about different conditions.
This thread would be more similar to the older team kicking the crap out of your daughter's team....

Understood. . . just trying to give an example of one benefit of a lopsided score. . . especially when it wasn't expected.

I guess my overall point was this: Play the game you are capable of and don't listen to the smack talk-- or do any smack talking yourself. If both teams played with integrity and composure, even under a lopsided finish, then something is gained on both sides of the ball.

It is when the fist pumping and dressing-down during or after the game occurs between players and or parent, this where something is lost and the game is no longer "beautiful".

[Unregistered]

Understood. . . just trying to give an example of one benefit of a lopsided score. . . especially when it wasn't expected.

I guess my overall point was this: Play the game you are capable of and don't listen to the smack talk-- or do any smack talking yourself. If both teams played with integrity and composure, even under a lopsided finish, then something is gained on both sides of the ball.

It is when the fist pumping and dressing-down during or after the game occurs between players and or parent, this where something is lost and the game is no longer "beautiful".

I'm afraid a lose like that is ugly even without the fist pumping and smack talk.

What I don't understand is why the winning coach didn't restructure to make it more challenging/instructive for his players. A win like this doesn't do anything for his team either. Put the goalie on field and a field player in goal, take off a player, switch the defense and offense around. There's a tons of ways to make this more competitive and fun without totally humiliating the other team with keep away or a drudging. I've been on both sides or the coin, and it works.

So I just don't get it. By about the 4th goal, nobody's cheering and the winners aren't having much fun either. So why do this?

[Unregistered]

I was not at the game. It's possible this situation is not quite as clearcut as both sides want to paint it.

Imagine a team has been working on finishing and specific offensive patterns and strategy for a couple weeks. What if the coach is attempting to teach his players to support, overlap, and cross appropriately from the wings, for example. As soon as he realizes the game is a blowout, should he disregard the last two weeks training focus and play keep-away, or should he encourage and allow all the players to try to execute their newly acquired skills? I can imagine a situation where two coaches know the disparity, agree to go forward, with the stronger team working on their crossing, and the other working on their defending. My child was once in exactly this situation and the much more talented opposition spent the second half only scoring on headers. His team, although pummeled, did gain from the experience. Fall Maple, and good weather don't last long. Don't we all want our clubs and coaches to maximize teaching moments?

[Unregistered]

I'll take a stab at this one (not FO or DC by the way).

Here's one possible scenario that shows one potential benefit.


This gave more than a little bit of a fire for our girls to "kick it up a knotch". They played with a little extra determination. In this particular game, I remember my daughter's team winning 11-0. It got to the point where the older players and parents were silenced and standing there with jaws dropped and nothing to say.

The benefit: Not only did our girls learn composure and to play in the face of negative comments and against much older, bigger players, but the older, bigger players (and parents) learned to be careful not to judge other teams by age or physical stature. I don't believe a 1-0 or even a 4-0 win would have accomplished what an 11-0 win did. You can't call an 11-0 game "lucky" or blame it on the refs. BOTH sides of this game learned a lesson that day.

This was one of many times where comments such as these before a game ended up being disproven. Over time, my daughter's team learned that "smack talk" and negativity shouldn't have any bearing on how you play. And I'm certain that many of the older teams (and boys teams!) and parents learned valuable lessons as well.

Still I think there was very little "benefit" anyway. It might have felt good and I am sure it was fun in a sick way, but no real benefit as far as I can see. What see as the benefit is interesting but not really all that great.

[Unregistered]

I'll take a stab at this one (not FO or DC by the way).

Here's one possible scenario that shows one potential benefit.

A couple of years ago, my daughter (U11 at the time) was on a very good team. In order to avoide the 16 - 0 type victories, the coach began playing better out of state competition, playing them up against older teams locally and sometimes older boys teams. Now granted, some of these teams were high school JV teams or other "B" club teams (U13/14), but older nonetheless.

Prior to one memorable game, parents and players from the opposing team were negatively commenting -- within earshot of my daughter's team -- "We shouldn't be playing these girls, we're going to crush them", "Look at how small they are", "What a waste of our time." and "Why do they even try. . . they don't have a chance." I'm sure you've all heard these types of comments. Very vocal and purposely said loudly to try to embarrass our girls.

This gave more than a little bit of a fire for our girls to "kick it up a knotch". They played with a little extra determination. In this particular game, I remember my daughter's team winning 11-0. It got to the point where the older players and parents were silenced and standing there with jaws dropped and nothing to say.

The benefit: Not only did our girls learn composure and to play in the face of negative comments and against much older, bigger players, but the older, bigger players (and parents) learned to be careful not to judge other teams by age or physical stature. I don't believe a 1-0 or even a 4-0 win would have accomplished what an 11-0 win did. You can't call an 11-0 game "lucky" or blame it on the refs. BOTH sides of this game learned a lesson that day.

This was one of many times where comments such as these before a game ended up being disproven. Over time, my daughter's team learned that "smack talk" and negativity shouldn't have any bearing on how you play. And I'm certain that many of the older teams (and boys teams!) and parents learned valuable lessons as well.

Maybe they should make a movie based on this event.

[Unregistered]

I have really been trying to avoid commenting on this but I just can't walk away from this one.

Yes, I have been on both sides of this situation.

Just recently in a game I looked at the other team warming up and knew right away it was going to be a wipe out. I had my goalie start as a striker and took my best players and had them rotate in goal. And my goalie was NOT a field player, believe me. By the 2nd half I was down to 9 players (one of which was this goalie) and we had a 5-0 lead. My players were instructed do keep playing the way they would normally (So as not to gain bad habits) and if they had an goal scoring opportunity to shoot wide. My rational is if you are good enough to hit the net..You are good enough to miss it to. And yes, my backs played up, strikers had time as defenders, etc. The final score was 6-2 and we missed the net a solid 1/2 dozen times in the 2nd H. My kids could not wait to have the game end, it was no fun per se but they used it as time to work on skills, moves and positional play they would not have otherwise done in a more competitive games. I had both the head and assn coach come over to my players and thank them for showing class and restraint along with a few of the parents of the other team who spoke to me directly. As I have done earlier when I found myself on the other side of a few of these games and it was clear the other team/coach was holding his players back.

There are numerous issues here and in no particular order

1) Competitive sports and any level, in particular for pre-teens should INCLUDE teaching RESPECT (for yourself, your opponent, the referee and the game itself) and Sportmanship. If you fail to do so you have not done your job ... and doing so is not in conflict with teaching skills or competitive drive. The end result of not doing this is creating the shallow, self centered, over pampered, egotistical and obnoxious professional athletes we see today that have abundant natural athletic gifts and skill but the social acumen of a doorstop. Think Pittsburgh's quarterback.... Athletics is a real chance to teach class and was certainly an opportunity missed here.

2) Arrogance. Both these coaches and others roasted here in previous threads for running up the score (BB) usually have little fear of the table being turned on them. Does anyone really think we will see the day when any FH team will give a JD coached Stars team a 16-0 beat down. Not real likely in the near future. But pride do cometh before the fall. For every self centered little teenage Mia Monster you attract by this win you will lose the excellent and skill player of character and leadership that will look (or who's family will direct them) elsewhere ... and please do not tell me this doesn't happen. There is a reason that last years Stars U-13G State Cup champion team was the Athletics and NOT the hyped United team and it was not a coincidence, it was the 2nd year in a row.

3) Did the kids enjoy this...We can be sure the FH team was not having fun but unless the entire Stars team was a group of little monsters I am pretty sure they were not really enjoying it either. Watch the kids body language. When they stop celebrating goals as a team the fun is gone and when they are casual to the point of embarrassed when they score the kids GET IT ... even if the adult instructors do not. But being kids, they will do as they are told and being on an elite team they will do WHAT THEY ARE TOLD so as not to lose their slot. But I doubt any of the kids were enjoying this game past the first 20 minutes and if they were mores the pity.

4) This was NOT the FH teams choice. In the Fall of U-11 MAPLE randomly places teams in divisions with some geographic considerations. That there should be a better system is certainly debatable but to state that this team "Got what it asked for" is misinformed. This does start to sort itself out as seasons provide history and records past U-11 fall and the competition becomes more even. I doubt very highly that the difference between a 5-0 or 6-0 win and a 16-0 win will make any difference in the eventual placement of JD's team in MAPLE Blue in the Spring. There was no reason to do this other than "they could"

5) If this was a U-15 and older game..well so be it. They are then young adults and have chosen their path and its consequences and it is the time to start learning some of the adult lessons you will need to know when you are out in the world and on your own. At 10 years old however, we should be encouraging young people to stay active and have a love of the game this does nothing to help keep these kids on the pitch and out of trouble later down the road. For those applauding these smack downs, let me say it again...THEY ARE 10 YEARS OLD. We lament that in this day and age our kids are "growing up to soon" and then we applaud the adult like lesson that "life is hard" and unless you are good enough "it sucks to be you"....Really, is this the lessons you want YOUR 10 YEAR OLD taught. If so, for the love of god please stop breeding, the world has seen enough monsters like your children will become.

I review situations like this with my players and parents right at the beginning of the season, why we will not continue pound on another team when the game is clearly not a match of equals. I make it very clear that I understand the incredible influence a coach has on young people and how I take very seriously not just teaching soccer but to be another appropriate role model for the children entrusted to me each week. As coaches we are and should be more than just instructors and there is a real disconnect if these adults fail to see and take responsibility for the roles they have chosen for themselves.

In the end, it is called SPORTMANSHIP for a reason and that is because it can and should be taught within the parameters of sporting activities.

I know there are lots (sorry, but WAY to many) people here who disagree with me, but this weekend and every weekend we are tested as adults and role models to very impressionable (10 YEAR OLD) young children. And last weekend these coaches failed miserably to meet even the lowest standards of dignity or restraint.

They may be able to teach skills and tactics, but in my opinion they need a refresher course in moral and honorable behavior before they hit the pitch again with young children.

Bravo! Hopefully there is a silent majority that thinks this way.

[Unregistered]

Bravo! Hopefully there is a silent majority that thinks this way.

Adopt a mercy rule like they do in softball/baseball and if it occurs before half have them play short sided games with a mixed team for the second half. If coaches don't want to mix the teams then there are hundreds of competitive drills they could do especially at that age where the field space is not needed.

[Unregistered]

Nice story and while your U11's sound like they were indeed a strong group, their circumstance and how they handled it that particular day is not really on point. Once the Stars realized the circumstances with which they were presented with on Sunday, they should have made reasonable adjustments to minimize the run-up. Just my opinion I realize, but Stars vs. FH took place in fall MAPLE, which is decidedly different from an instance where a team of known strength seeks an appropriate challenge by playing up against older competition.

How do you know they didn't? It's certainly has been pointed out what steps most coaches take, but the good ones (and apparently that is a matter of opinion) would never ask their teams to stop scoring completely.

[Unregistered]

The good "ones" also respect the game and their opponents.

[Unregistered]

How do you know they didn't? It's certainly has been pointed out what steps most coaches take, but the good ones (and apparently that is a matter of opinion) would never ask their teams to stop scoring completely.

I recommended making "reasonable adjustments" to avoid further insult in an obvious blowout. I never suggested they should or would stop scoring altogether, which sometimes can't be helped without things starting to look absurd --e.g., passing away from goal instead of shooting when inside the 6, etc.

in the end, the final score speaks for itself IMHO