MATHMAN UPDATE

[mathman]

Algorithm question for mathman:

I noticed in the U15 National rating that Stars of Mass United had the same rating as the last update. I assume that means that the 2-1 result over STA Crush cost them as many points as the 4-0 result over the Killer Bees (ENY)? Is that correct? Just interested how the points change hands. Either way, nice to see a MA team with a top rating!

You can't lose rating points by beating a team. Stars would gain 1 point from beating STA, and 6 from beating KB with the given scores. When you are as high-rated as they are, you don't gain a lot of points by beating teams rated 400-500 points lower than you, since you would be expected to beat them. Basically, Stars gained points only because they did not lose or tie the lower-rated team.

The Stars rating did not change from the previous update because I had not included any of their games since then. In particular, the Region I games were not included. The next update will be on May 7, and will include Maple and Region I games to that time.

The next update will be on May 7, and will include Maple and Region I games to that time.

Will any spring tournaments be included?

[mathman]

The next update will be on May 7, and will include Maple and Region I games to that time.

Will any spring tournaments be included?

I guess that depends on what you mean by "spring." If after March 21, yes. But those have already been included (unless I missed some: then they will be included later).

I won't be running any additional tournaments until leagues are pretty much done. I will do an update before the Memorial Day tournaments, and that may include some April and early May tournaments.

Once I start running teams through league, it's just too confusing and time-consuming to run them through tournaments at the same time. I usually wait until they have finished league play before running them through tournaments. That has the benefit of allowing me to use the tournaments to normalize the ratings between leagues and states.

(snip)

There are two Albertson teams in that age group at the U-15 level. The Div. 2 team and a newly formed one that is just a tornament team. They find guest players to go to the big tornaments because they do not have enough for a roster. The Div. 2 team has not strengthened they consist of different players totally. So now that new albertson team has only played in two tornaments playing a total of maybe 8-9 games .
The other team is not in a league because of the lack of rostered players, so they are rostered to other teams within the league from what I heard.
If you look at LIJSL that team has already lost the state cup by many goals and in LIJSL play. But mathman's rating of that team would be false. They have not played that many games together only about 8-9.

I think I follow what you are saying here, but to be sure, could you answer this:

There is a team (call it A) called Albertson 92 Fury in LIJSL D1 this spring.

There was a team (call it B) of the same name that played LIJSL D2 both seasons last year at U14, and played D1 in Fall 07.

There is a team (call it C) called Albertson Fury that has played in several tournaments last Fall, and this spring.

Is team B now team A, or team C, both, or neither?

If team B is A, but not C, where did team C come from?

If team A and team C are not the same team, why do they have the same name?

If team A and team C are not the same team, why does the Albertson website list only one team, and not two?

I would have preferred to ask you these questions in a PM, but can't, since you are not registered. Could you either register, so that you can PM me with the answers, or send the answers to me via the ratings website?

I don't think many posters on this list care about the issue, but I do.

Looking at the gotsoccer site some teams have rosters posted, there are two Albertson teams in the U-15 age group with 2 different sets of rosters. One roster even has players on it from a younger age group. How can you be rostered on 2 different teams. What is that all about? Can you be rostered on two teams at the same time in the same club?

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

The 5/7 update has happened. Anything to discuss here?

Top ten Massachusetts U14 teams-

new rating, last year's rating, number of games rated, name of team

1 1554 / 1443 128 Stars of Mass United
2 1545 / 1550 126 Scorpions Elite
3 1254 / 1208 70 Pioneers
4 1244 / 1249 82 Fuller Hamlets A
5 1237 / 1029 79 Crusaders FC
6 1191 / 1292 100 Blackhawks Predators
7 1181 / 1155 82 South Shore Select
8 1165 / 1150 42 MPS Boston Renegades 94 Pr
9 1160 / 1078 91 FC Greater Boston
10 1145 / 1216 80 FC Puma

Top ten Massachusetts U15 teams-

new rating, last year's rating, number of games rated, name of team

1 1928 / 1810 157 FC Stars of Mass United
2 1655 / 1672 152 Scorpions Elite
3 1523 / 1504 129 FC Stars of Mass Rovers
4 1290 / 1216 83 Aztecs
5 1265 / 1292 113 Fuller Hamlets
6 1248 / 1148 84 Crusaders A [United]
7 1226 / 1214 102 Inter Bandits
8 1196 / 1178 96 NE Eagles
9 1153 / 1218 88 FC Puma
10 1151 / 1148 47 MPS Renegades

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

The 5/7 update has happened. Anything to discuss here?

Top ten Massachusetts U14 teams-

new rating, last year's rating, number of games rated, name of team

1 1554 / 1443 128 Stars of Mass United
2 1545 / 1550 126 Scorpions Elite
3 1254 / 1208 70 Pioneers
4 1244 / 1249 82 Fuller Hamlets A
5 1237 / 1029 79 Crusaders FC
6 1191 / 1292 100 Blackhawks Predators
7 1181 / 1155 82 South Shore Select
8 1165 / 1150 42 MPS Boston Renegades 94 Pr
9 1160 / 1078 91 FC Greater Boston
10 1145 / 1216 80 FC Puma

Crusaders United coming into line, will drop a bit more, but now looking at Selects?

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

Looks like both Crusaders teams have improved significantly as have Stars United. Most of the others are pretty much treading water.

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

Looks like both Crusaders teams have improved significantly as have Stars United. Most of the others are pretty much treading water.

How can the 2 MPS teams have such a difference in the number of rated games? I thought they generally played the same schedule.

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

Which 2 MPS teams are you referring to? MPS Crusaders and Crusaders FC are separate entities.

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

Which 2 MPS teams are you referring to? MPS Crusaders and Crusaders FC are separate entities.

MPS Crusaders and MPS Renegades. One has 40+ rated games and the other 30.

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

is it mathman or madman?

Pioneers#3
Crusaders#4
Blackhawks#6
Puma#10

It is time to stop the rankings and see what teams actually can play something that resembles soccer. Stop fueling the debate of ranking based on wins and losses in
entirely meaningless games.If that is the case league standings shoud adversely affect these rankings and apparently they do not. Aztecs are in D2 well ahead of Puma yet nowhere to be found on the top 10. Nova/Pasa/FCGB all higher than Pioneers/Selects and Blackhawks seem to loose ground. All legitimate questions and if anyone can beat anyone within certain point spread how do you rank some higher than others? Mathman has mixed something else in this formula...

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

is it mathman or madman?

Pioneers#3
Crusaders#4
Blackhawks#6
Puma#10

It is time to stop the rankings and see what teams actually can play something that resembles soccer. Stop fueling the debate of ranking based on wins and losses in
entirely meaningless games.If that is the case league standings shoud adversely affect these rankings and apparently they do not. Aztecs are in D2 well ahead of Puma yet nowhere to be found on the top 10. Nova/Pasa/FCGB all higher than Pioneers/Selects and Blackhawks seem to loose ground. All legitimate questions and if anyone can beat anyone within certain point spread how do you rank some higher than others? Mathman has mixed something else in this formula...

Here's the next ten-

11 1140 / 1056 74 Aztecs White Flame
12 1123 / 1112 93 Stars of Mass Athletic
13 1105 / 1112 86 NE Eagles
14 1100 / 1011 83 Nova Eclipse
15 1096 / 1159 71 Western United
16 1094 / 1071 90 PASA
17 1035 / 859 31 MPS Cape Cod Lady Crusaders 94
18 1018 / 924 77 Explosion
19 1009 / NA 14 Soccer Domain *
20 992 / 899 60 Liverpool

Obviously Aztecs is on the way up and Puma is on the way down if you look at the trend. This is the way it is supposed to work,

[mathman]

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

(snip)

All legitimate questions and if anyone can beat anyone within certain point spread how do you rank some higher than others? Mathman has mixed something else in this formula...

You didn't ask any questions in the part I snipped out, so there is nothing to respond to.

It is true that "anyone can beat anyone within [a] certain point spread," if one picks a definite point spread, and "can" is interpreted statistically. The details are on the website, though it sounds like you don't really want to spend any time there. Different strokes for different folks.

I am not sure what you meant by the last comment, though I could guess. *If* you are intimating that I favor some teams over others, or put anything *other* than the scores of games into the formula, may I disabuse you of that notion? I'm not aware of personally knowing any player or parent currently in these two age groups, and until I went to the U15 Stars/Scorpions Region I game, I had never seen any of these teams play.

My youngest daughter is a U19, and her Maple team, though state finalist last year, couldn't get enough commitments to play in State Cup, so, after 18 years, I am done with youth soccer, except for the website.

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

Hi Mathman-

I assume that you surprised at the results of the Stars/Scorpions game? Do you think Stars got lucky as many do or do you think that actually they've moved beyond where they were last year as your ratings might reflect?

Re: MATHMAN UPDATE

Hi Mathman-

I assume that you surprised at the results of the Stars/Scorpions game? Do you think Stars got lucky as many do or do you think that actually they've moved beyond where they were last year as your ratings might reflect?

Which Stars game did you see? Or did you see both?