Overage players and why you shouldn't care

[Unregistered]

A youth coach in Georgia blasts his colleagues for their cynicism regarding overage players

http://www.acoachinglife.wordpress.com

[Cujo]

A youth coach in Georgia blasts his colleagues for their cynicism regarding overage players

http://www.acoachinglife.wordpress.com

I take a different stance. It is the responsibility of the governing leage to insure that every player is of proper age. If they did this coaches and parents would not have any reason to be cynical. I guarantee you that MAPLE has many overage players playing at the U14 level.

[Unregistered]

This is not complicated.

The issue with overage players is that 1) they exist - don't kid yourself and imagine otherwise, 2) the search for elite soccer talent ends with 15 year olds - a kid who hasn't been recognized by then has little chance, because national team and academy coaches are interesting in developing talent starting from a young age. 3) It's pretty obvious that an above average 15 y.o. can appear to be an outstanding 13 y.o.. 4) kids coming to the US from many places where birth records are non-existent or impossible to check are wise to the advantage of understating their age.

There is a real cost to letting this happen. It obscures the real talent in the youth pool, sending the investment meant for them to kids who are physically more mature, who have developed their skills more slowly. It's not just a problem for the people stuck with playing by the rules, its a problem for US soccer, which is getting stuck with '13 year olds' who have stopped growing and improving.

[Cujo]

This is not complicated.

The issue with overage players is that 1) they exist - don't kid yourself and imagine otherwise, 2) the search for elite soccer talent ends with 15 year olds - a kid who hasn't been recognized by then has little chance, because national team and academy coaches are interesting in developing talent starting from a young age. 3) It's pretty obvious that an above average 15 y.o. can appear to be an outstanding 13 y.o.. 4) kids coming to the US from many places where birth records are non-existent or impossible to check are wise to the advantage of understating their age.

There is a real cost to letting this happen. It obscures the real talent in the youth pool, sending the investment meant for them to kids who are physically more mature, who have developed their skills more slowly. It's not just a problem for the people stuck with playing by the rules, its a problem for US soccer, which is getting stuck with '13 year olds' who have stopped growing and improving.

If you are a coach and someone challenges your integrity by questioning whether you have overage players what is the problem:

1) If you are ethical and honest you have verified your players ages by properly vetting their birth certificates. I would actually have been happy at any time proving my players were the proper age. I NEVER had an overage player on my roster to the best of my knowledge. The only chance that it could have happened is if a parent photo-shopped a birth certificate. This is unlikely as I knew my players, what grade they were in. When they got their driver licenses etc. When I was on the board of RYS we rejected several players for a U14 team because their BS's appeared to have been doctored. With a little research we discovered that they were both juniors in HS.

2) If you are unethical and get questioned and then caught then you deserve whatever punishment that you receive. There are two kinds of people in this world. Those that cheat and those that don't cheat.

3) Maple does not vet birth certificates. It is up to the coach to vet. If there is so little integrity when it comes to sideline behavior, recruiting, delivering on promises to players and parents how much of a leap is it to assume that they will take a 15 year old stud for a U14 team especially if she is from a town where no other players originate from.

As I have stated many times I personally watched several players from SS Select years ago drive cars away from a Spring U14 game. I think it was in 2000 or 2001. Could be off by a year though. We all probably remember the Spirit Boys team that got bagged.

Anybody who believes that this is an isolated situation is burying their heads in the sand.

This is what happens when the likelyhood and / or consequences of getting caught fall well short of the potential accolades and rewards if you don't get caught.

[Cujo]

This is not complicated.

The issue with overage players is that 1) they exist - don't kid yourself and imagine otherwise, 2) the search for elite soccer talent ends with 15 year olds - a kid who hasn't been recognized by then has little chance, because national team and academy coaches are interesting in developing talent starting from a young age. 3) It's pretty obvious that an above average 15 y.o. can appear to be an outstanding 13 y.o.. 4) kids coming to the US from many places where birth records are non-existent or impossible to check are wise to the advantage of understating their age.

There is a real cost to letting this happen. It obscures the real talent in the youth pool, sending the investment meant for them to kids who are physically more mature, who have developed their skills more slowly. It's not just a problem for the people stuck with playing by the rules, its a problem for US soccer, which is getting stuck with '13 year olds' who have stopped growing and improving.

Yep Freddy Adu sure seemed to peak at a certain age.

[Unregistered]

if my child is playing against an older child, who is bigger, faster, stronger, more skilled, etc. it will only serve to provide my child with a higher level of competition and subsequently improve my child's game. In high school, freshmen are playing against players 3&4 years older, college the same. Age shouldn't matter, improving should.

[Unregistered]

my son played with a kid at U11-U12 that was from another country with a questionable birth cert. He certainly looked older and far more skilled that all others, he moved on to another club and "played up" according to some to get better competition. Funny thing is my son is now an 8th grader and this kid is a HS soph! Maybe he is just really really smart too.

[Cujo]

if my child is playing against an older child, who is bigger, faster, stronger, more skilled, etc. it will only serve to provide my child with a higher level of competition and subsequently improve my child's game. In high school, freshmen are playing against players 3&4 years older, college the same. Age shouldn't matter, improving should.

Not when your 4' 5" 65 lb 12 year old kid gets taken down from behind by a 5' 10" 165 lb 14 man-child. Your kid is not going to get better. They are going to get frustrated. Your 12 year old is learning technical, the 14 year has technical and is learning tactical. Different soccer animals.

I hope you are only a parent and not a coach or affiliated with a club.

Get back to me when your kid has graduated from college. I am going to bet you $100 right here and now that he will not be making a living playing soccer.

Let your kid play with his peers so he enjoys his experience.

Your age analogy is horrible. By Freshman year most males have matured. Furthermore it is unlikely that they will be playing varsity if it is a good HS team. No matter how good they are they will be relegated to Fresh or JV teams. At age 15 age becomes largely irrelevant for playing up. Playing DOWN is a different matter.

Do us all a favor and sit back down in your lawn chair. Have a latte.

[Cujo]

my son played with a kid at U11-U12 that was from another country with a questionable birth cert. He certainly looked older and far more skilled that all others, he moved on to another club and "played up" according to some to get better competition. Funny thing is my son is now an 8th grader and this kid is a HS soph! Maybe he is just really really smart too.

Not surprising. Ever been to Disney? Half of Europe can't figure out how to fairly queue for a ride. What makes you think they are going to play fair when it comes to sports.

[Unregistered]

We played a North Shore team @ U-14, Div 2 team. Two of the kids from the other team drove to the game which we thought was pretty funny. They were obviously older and good players, but they lost anyway. Didn't protest it, our coach just shrugged his shoulders.

I guess when its Div 1 or a state cup match it means something more than just one more game for the other kids. Kids talk about it to this day. Was a fun game though because the kids were so fast they were off sides continuosly and argued with the refs who obviously knew what was up.

They were all Brazilian and spoke in their native tongue non stop. They could not figure out why our team knew what they were going to do. They were unaware that three of our players spoke Portuguese including my son.

51

[Unregistered]

We played a North Shore team @ U-14, Div 2 team. Two of the kids from the other team drove to the game which we thought was pretty funny. They were obviously older and good players, but they lost anyway. Didn't protest it, our coach just shrugged his shoulders.

I guess when its Div 1 or a state cup match it means something more than just one more game for the other kids. Kids talk about it to this day. Was a fun game though because the kids were so fast they were off sides continuosly and argued with the refs who obviously knew what was up.

They were all Brazilian and spoke in their native tongue non stop. They could not figure out why our team knew what they were going to do. They were unaware that three of our players spoke Portuguese including my son.

51

Funny. Soccer is skill based game. A year or 2 older is no big deal. Try to improve the skill and win, not try to knock down the other team first then win.

[Unregistered]

On another note, kinda of the inverse of the soccer overage players, the Empire Junior Hockey league is banning 20 year old players over a two year period.

Hockey is beset by the junior hockey problem which has resulted in hockey players starting their freshman year @ 20 or 21. I feel this is not in the spirit of college hockey. Hopefully this is a good step.

There is a new Hockey league starting up< ECHC, sounds it was put together by a Cujo follower. I think, but not completely sure, you make the team you are on the team for 3-4 years, no other tryouts, a true Cujo mantra. "The model puts more emphasis on skill development and age specific training rather than extensive travel and competition". Scott Fusco, a Hobey Baker award winner is leading this effort.

My conversations with various coaches indicate that the rat race for players by teams (sound familiar) has resulted in a race to the bottom in regards to development in Mass.. I still think these kids specialize too early and need to cross train with other sports.

[Unregistered]

Funny. Soccer is skill based game. A year or 2 older is no big deal. Try to improve the skill and win, not try to knock down the other team first then win.

The physical difference between a 13 and 15 year old can be a major factor. Speed and size do count in soccer no matter what you think. It is a BIG deal in many circumstances.

[Cujo]

The physical difference between a 13 and 15 year old can be a major factor. Speed and size do count in soccer no matter what you think. It is a BIG deal in many circumstances.

It is not just an issue in the difference physically but also mentally. Tactical development is implicit until U13/14. A 15 year old and a 13 year are light years apart in terms of their arc of development. 2 years matters. They have 40% or more time spent as an athlete.

But the physical stuff is important as well. In the U14 boys games that I do there are U12 teams that play up. You have kids that are pushing 6 feet and over going against kids that are under 5 ft (sometimes WELL under) in a purely legal 50/50 challenge who is going to win most of the time? How is the 11 year old benefitting from that experience? Obviously player size differences will always exist at the older ages in every sport (i.e. Zdeno Chara vs Brian Gionta) but these players have been trained tactically and are mentally mature in terms of soccer IQ.

As a parent maybe you get an ego rush by bragging that your 11 year old is playing against 14 year olds but it ain't DEVELOPMENT.

[Unregistered]

But the physical stuff is important as well. In the U14 boys games that I do there are U12 teams that play up. You have kids that are pushing 6 feet and over going against kids that are under 5 ft (sometimes WELL under) in a purely legal 50/50 challenge who is going to win most of the time? How is the 11 year old benefitting from that experience? Obviously player size differences will always exist at the older ages in every sport (i.e. Zdeno Chara vs Brian Gionta) but these players have been trained tactically and are mentally mature in terms of soccer IQ.

As a parent maybe you get an ego rush by bragging that your 11 year old is playing against 14 year olds but it ain't DEVELOPMENT.

In these games the U12 boys learn much more than the U14 boys, which is not too bad for the U12s. By the way the thread is about 1-2 possible overaged suspects, not the whole team.