Merry Christmas from Donald Trump

[Unregistered]

You believe that because Trump tells you. Dems have had countless immigration reform proposals and they're always shot down by Trump and the GOP. We want safe borders, proper vetting, an opportunity for asylum seekers to apply as per international law, changes to the Visa system, and personally I also want an end to birth right citizenship. But I also want our nation to offer refuge to those most in need and to come up with ways that control immigration without being cruel and heartless. A wall will barely make a dent in the issue when 70% come in legally and stay. Even border agents want more agents and more technology

And what would be the impact of such a wall on the eco-systems along the border? How about natural wild animal migrations? Do we think good old Mother Nature will just roll with such an edifice and not be impacted?

[Unregistered]

Wall=$5 billion+. Ladder=$100. Mexico is laughing at us. How about 21st solutions?

Would you rather spend the money on a wall or would you rather spend some of this money to restore clean drinking water to Flint, Michigan? Are you prepared to spend any of this money on the thousands of government employees who are not eligible for back pay lost during the shutdown?

Where is the expenditure of the $1.3 billion Congress gave the President last year for his wall? Didn't the last check into the ledgers reveal that these monies are still not spent?

[Unregistered]

Isn't it equally funny that the House Democrats have proposed and presented a spending bill that was formerly approved by the Republican controlled House and Senate just over two weeks ago and Trump was prepared to sign? Isn't the House bill exactly the same as that submitted by the Republicans? You know the answer to that already, don't you?[/QUOTE]

No, it’s actually not. The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump. In it is billions more for foreign aid than was requested. It was a shot across the bow if you will. Both sides are playing games and equally to blame. Dems don’t seem to know why they oppose this so vehemently. On moral grounds as someone else said. Or the cost. Or bc they can’t stand Trump. I don’t particularly like him myself, but I’m not going to root against him to succeed bc I don’t like the guy. It’s silly. They should get to work, compromise and reach a deal where everyone wins. People opposed to the wall bc they think it’s a waste really don’t know if it is. No one does bc we haven’t had one on the southern border. They can make guesses as to how it would function, but not one person can effectively say for certain.

The reality is that the Dems will oppose Trump at all costs. Most have made it clear that’s their objective. If they disguised it a little better, then maybe they’d be a bit more believable in their moral crusade. That’s all this is. Politics at its finest. GOP has done it as well. It’s a joke which is why I don’t take our Gov seriously. Nothing will change and nothing will get done. People will just point fingers at the other party and try to survey the landscape and support only those things that will help them get re-elected. Term limits would help, but do you seriously think the people they would affect would actually pass something that would get them out of office? LOL. As I said, it’s a joke.

[Unregistered]

Post the link to one please

Based on government statistics: "Border crossings don't even account for a majority of the people joining the unauthorized population in a given year. In fiscal 2016, for instance, the Department of Homeland Security estimated 628,799 people who had previously entered the country legally overstayed their visa that year. Other groups, such as the Center for Migration Studies, have similarly estimated that visa overstays account for about two-thirds of the total number of people joining the undocumented population in any given year.

“The number attempting to get across the Southern border is probably the lowest it's been since at least the 1970s,” said Robert Warren, a demographer with the Center for Migration Studies. “I'm surprised the [Trump] administration hasn't really focused on overstays. That's where the action is.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.d2533103d60f

The larger growth is illegals from China, India, Russia. http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/0...Its-Not-Mexico

More on illegal overstays, http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/0...Its-Not-Mexico

Link to DHS press release on overstays https://www.dhs.gov/news/2017/05/22/...verstay-report

DHS detailed report on overstays https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/fi...ear%202016.pdf


Border agents

A report released today by the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Democrats said Border Patrol agents want technology and personnel to assist their mission, not a border wall. The report, “Border Security: Analysis of Vulnerabilities Identified by Frontline Agents,” looks at the data collected annually by CBP from frontline agents and chiefs along each of the Border Patrol sectors along the Southwest border. It found that less than one-half of 1 percent of the solutions Border Patrol agents and sector chiefs proposed for closing capability gaps along the southwest border in FY 2017 referenced a “wall.” The Border Patrol personnel identified a total of 902 southwest border capability gaps through the CGAP process. The word “wall” was suggested as a possible solution for just three of those gaps...“To be sure, there were instances in which Border Patrol agents proposed ‘fencing’ or other tactical infrastructure, such as patrol roads, lighting, and storm drain grates, for addressing current capability gaps,” says the report. “But, more often, technological and personnel solutions, such as sensors, cameras, improved radio communications systems, additional hiring, and better training, were proposed. ” https://www.hstoday.us/industry/dail...ff-not-a-wall/

[Unregistered]

Why should I do the homework? Am I purporting this information as justification for a wall? Or is that you? Can't you provide facts to back up your claims? Why should I consider your input as viable if you cannot back it up?

Who here has suggested that we ignore illegal border crossings? Who in our government has suggested that we ignore illegal border crossings?

Isn't this $5 billion the same amount that McConnell shut down the government for a while back when he thought that money was too much for health care? How could it be too much for health care expenditures and not too much for a border wall?

Isn't it equally funny that the House Democrats have proposed and presented a spending bill that was formerly approved by the Republican controlled House and Senate just over two weeks ago and Trump was prepared to sign? Isn't the House bill exactly the same as that submitted by the Republicans? You know the answer to that already, don't you?

So what has happened in the last two weeks? What made the President change his mind? Could it be that Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh are actually running things here?

They presented Trump an even better deal a year ago with $20B for a wall, but it had DACA so he rejected it. Had he signed it we wouldn't be here now. What's absurd is most Americans support DACA.

[Unregistered]

Post the link to one please

Don't be so lazy.... do some work yourself... then post it and we will see if we approve...

[Unregistered]

The biggest frustration with this entire debate is tacking immigration issues to the budget. immigration reform and spending to support it should be debated separately. it's a very complex issue and deserves a deep dive into how to make it better. Tack-ons happen far too often in Congressional bills and all it does is either bog-down the process, as well as make it easier for members to get pet projects through. Or, in this case, we shut down the US government over an issue that most Americans don't want.

[Unregistered]

Don't be so lazy.... do some work yourself... then post it and we will see if we approve...

Another poster did supply links. Let's see how doubting thomas responds.

[Unregistered]

Isn't it equally funny that the House Democrats have proposed and presented a spending bill that was formerly approved by the Republican controlled House and Senate just over two weeks ago and Trump was prepared to sign? Isn't the House bill exactly the same as that submitted by the Republicans? You know the answer to that already, don't you?

No, it’s actually not. The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump. In it is billions more for foreign aid than was requested. It was a shot across the bow if you will. Both sides are playing games and equally to blame. Dems don’t seem to know why they oppose this so vehemently. On moral grounds as someone else said. Or the cost. Or bc they can’t stand Trump. I don’t particularly like him myself, but I’m not going to root against him to succeed bc I don’t like the guy. It’s silly. They should get to work, compromise and reach a deal where everyone wins. People opposed to the wall bc they think it’s a waste really don’t know if it is. No one does bc we haven’t had one on the southern border. They can make guesses as to how it would function, but not one person can effectively say for certain.

The reality is that the Dems will oppose Trump at all costs. Most have made it clear that’s their objective. If they disguised it a little better, then maybe they’d be a bit more believable in their moral crusade. That’s all this is. Politics at its finest. GOP has done it as well. It’s a joke which is why I don’t take our Gov seriously. Nothing will change and nothing will get done. People will just point fingers at the other party and try to survey the landscape and support only those things that will help them get re-elected. Term limits would help, but do you seriously think the people they would affect would actually pass something that would get them out of office? LOL. As I said, it’s a joke.[/QUOTE]

<<The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump.>> Its the exact same bill... McConnell is a republickass ... playing politics plain and simple...
Note 1: Elections (Nov 2018) have consequences... start getting used to it
Note 2: Dems don't support the wall because it is a stupid, expensive and ultimately pointless proposal... tRUMP playing politics... and trying to divert from his inevitable demise
Note 3: Have you seen any Republickass Congressmen or Senators publicly pushing for the wall?

[Unregistered]

Another poster did supply links. Let's see how doubting thomas responds.

No... I want to see your work... it is easy to be nihilistic... why not try getting off your intellectually lazy ass for a change...

[Unregistered]

Isn't it equally funny that the House Democrats have proposed and presented a spending bill that was formerly approved by the Republican controlled House and Senate just over two weeks ago and Trump was prepared to sign? Isn't the House bill exactly the same as that submitted by the Republicans? You know the answer to that already, don't you?

No, it’s actually not. The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump. In it is billions more for foreign aid than was requested. It was a shot across the bow if you will. Both sides are playing games and equally to blame. Dems don’t seem to know why they oppose this so vehemently. On moral grounds as someone else said. Or the cost. Or bc they can’t stand Trump. I don’t particularly like him myself, but I’m not going to root against him to succeed bc I don’t like the guy. It’s silly. They should get to work, compromise and reach a deal where everyone wins. People opposed to the wall bc they think it’s a waste really don’t know if it is. No one does bc we haven’t had one on the southern border. They can make guesses as to how it would function, but not one person can effectively say for certain.

The reality is that the Dems will oppose Trump at all costs. Most have made it clear that’s their objective. If they disguised it a little better, then maybe they’d be a bit more believable in their moral crusade. That’s all this is. Politics at its finest. GOP has done it as well. It’s a joke which is why I don’t take our Gov seriously. Nothing will change and nothing will get done. People will just point fingers at the other party and try to survey the landscape and support only those things that will help them get re-elected. Term limits would help, but do you seriously think the people they would affect would actually pass something that would get them out of office? LOL. As I said, it’s a joke.[/QUOTE]


Would it surprise you that we pretty much agree on this?

After all, wasn't this precedent already set by the Republicans during the Obama administration?

And because we choose to put such petty and shallow people in office, should we expect them to act any different than those who came before?

And could it be that very thing that puts the opportunity for real change to come from someone like that young voice known now as AOC? Agreement with her views or not, doesn't it appear she seems to be focused on issues more than rhetoric? Will this prove to be a radical voice that somehow takes us back to the center where problems get solved?

[Unregistered]

The biggest frustration with this entire debate is tacking immigration issues to the budget. immigration reform and spending to support it should be debated separately. it's a very complex issue and deserves a deep dive into how to make it better. Tack-ons happen far too often in Congressional bills and all it does is either bog-down the process, as well as make it easier for members to get pet projects through. Or, in this case, we shut down the US government over an issue that most Americans don't want.

Wouldn't it be nice to eliminate lobbyists and thus, a significant source of these riders?

[Unregistered]

No, it’s actually not. The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump. In it is billions more for foreign aid than was requested. It was a shot across the bow if you will. Both sides are playing games and equally to blame. Dems don’t seem to know why they oppose this so vehemently. On moral grounds as someone else said. Or the cost. Or bc they can’t stand Trump. I don’t particularly like him myself, but I’m not going to root against him to succeed bc I don’t like the guy. It’s silly. They should get to work, compromise and reach a deal where everyone wins. People opposed to the wall bc they think it’s a waste really don’t know if it is. No one does bc we haven’t had one on the southern border. They can make guesses as to how it would function, but not one person can effectively say for certain.

The reality is that the Dems will oppose Trump at all costs. Most have made it clear that’s their objective. If they disguised it a little better, then maybe they’d be a bit more believable in their moral crusade. That’s all this is. Politics at its finest. GOP has done it as well. It’s a joke which is why I don’t take our Gov seriously. Nothing will change and nothing will get done. People will just point fingers at the other party and try to survey the landscape and support only those things that will help them get re-elected. Term limits would help, but do you seriously think the people they would affect would actually pass something that would get them out of office? LOL. As I said, it’s a joke.

<<The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump.>> Its the exact same bill... McConnell is a republickass ... playing politics plain and simple...
Note 1: Elections (Nov 2018) have consequences... start getting used to it
Note 2: Dems don't support the wall because it is a stupid, expensive and ultimately pointless proposal... tRUMP playing politics... and trying to divert from his inevitable demise
Note 3: Have you seen any Republickass Congressmen or Senators publicly pushing for the wall?[/QUOTE]

Note 2- dems did support building a wall when Obama was potus

[Unregistered]

Wouldn't it be nice to eliminate lobbyists and thus, a significant source of these riders?

Money in politics is a bigger threat to our democracy than Trump ever will be; that and the sheer stupidity of approximately 30% of our fellow countrymen and women.

[Unregistered]

<<The House Dems just passed a completely different bill that the Senate won’t even bring to a vote bc they know it will get shot down by Trump.>> Its the exact same bill... McConnell is a republickass ... playing politics plain and simple...
Note 1: Elections (Nov 2018) have consequences... start getting used to it
Note 2: Dems don't support the wall because it is a stupid, expensive and ultimately pointless proposal... tRUMP playing politics... and trying to divert from his inevitable demise
Note 3: Have you seen any Republickass Congressmen or Senators publicly pushing for the wall?

Note 2- dems did support building a wall when Obama was potus[/QUOTE]

Much of the existing fencing was put in during Obama and Bush's tenure. It was put in the most vulnerable places. There are probably a few more vulnerable spots that need work and should get what is needed. But trump's obsession in a single wall/fence from sea to shining sea. He thinks he's building the Great Wall of China. Anything that is built will be breached but it matters little because that is not how most illegals enter. Nor is it how most drugs come into the country (via individual cars, trucks, boats). The focus should be on manpower and tech.