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    #16
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    Yes while that story is sad it does seem the cop was justified in shooting. In the dark he certainly didn't know it was just a kid. He just knew it was someone with a gun. Problem is Chicago cops have a long ugly history with wrongful deaths. The city has paid out tens of millions from lawsuits and the Chicago PD is still a mess. People are angry.

    I know many are screaming cops should aim to injure, not kill. It's obviously preferred but if a gun actually is being pointed at you, do you take the risk you might not hit them at all, or they still hang on to the gun and shoot back at you? Not so easy in the heat of the moment - in fact they've done studies with police officers and in high stress situations shooting accuracy plummets.
    running around with a gun at 230 in the morning?
    what could happen?

    not a good plan

    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      running around with a gun at 230 in the morning?
      what could happen?

      not a good plan
      Bad parenting and bad choices shouldn't result in death. The kid had tossed the gun; there's a freeze frame shot showing his hands up, empty.

      Comment


        #18
        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        Yes while that story is sad it does seem the cop was justified in shooting. In the dark he certainly didn't know it was just a kid. He just knew it was someone with a gun. Problem is Chicago cops have a long ugly history with wrongful deaths. The city has paid out tens of millions from lawsuits and the Chicago PD is still a mess. People are angry.

        I know many are screaming cops should aim to injure, not kill. It's obviously preferred but if a gun actually is being pointed at you, do you take the risk you might not hit them at all, or they still hang on to the gun and shoot back at you? Not so easy in the heat of the moment - in fact they've done studies with police officers and in high stress situations shooting accuracy plummets.
        Sorry con but when the hands are visibly held in the air in compliance with directions, putting a bullet into that person is cold blooded murder.

        “Hands up don’t shoot!” Then they shoot anyway

        Comment


          #19
          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          Bad parenting and bad choices shouldn't result in death. The kid had tossed the gun; there's a freeze frame shot showing his hands up, empty.
          I saw the video. It was frozen when the shot was taken but his clearly empty hands were raised above his head in compliance with directions.

          Then the cop fired at point blank range.

          Comment


            #20
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            running around with a gun at 230 in the morning?
            what could happen?

            not a good plan
            Prosecutors had said Toledo was carrying a gun, but walked back the statement Thursday, saying the attorney “failed to fully inform himself,” and “the video speaks for itself,” the CBS affiliate reported.
            So prosecutors are backing away from their initial assertion that the kid was carrying again.

            Interesting.

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              So prosecutors are backing away from their initial assertion that the kid was carrying again.

              Interesting.
              He had been carrying one and there were reports of gunfire in the area, but he threw the gun away from his body and put his hands up. He complied, his hands were empty, and the cop still shot him.

              Why do the police and prosecutors keep thinking this won't eventually get out to the public? They wouldn't be vilified so much if they'd stop protecting bad cops. Does anyone really think the cop in last week's MN incident - a 20+ year veteran on the force - couldn't tell the difference between a taser and her service weapon? Again, the victim was no angel but did he deserve to die?

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                He had been carrying one and there were reports of gunfire in the area, but he threw the gun away from his body and put his hands up. He complied, his hands were empty, and the cop still shot him.

                Why do the police and prosecutors keep thinking this won't eventually get out to the public? They wouldn't be vilified so much if they'd stop protecting bad cops. Does anyone really think the cop in last week's MN incident - a 20+ year veteran on the force - couldn't tell the difference between a taser and her service weapon? Again, the victim was no angel but did he deserve to die?
                The bolded part speaks to my difficulty of late supporting all the “good” cops.

                I think most if not all know who the bad apples are, but that blue line seems to encourage protecting the criminal cops at all costs. So I’ve been struggling to find the good
                Cops who are stepping up to help change this system. There seem to be very few of them and far between.

                When more states get rid of qualified immunity like NY just did, things might change. I could see cops sued back to the Stone Age for their failure to take action against criminal cops.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  The bolded part speaks to my difficulty of late supporting all the “good” cops.

                  I think most if not all know who the bad apples are, but that blue line seems to encourage protecting the criminal cops at all costs. So I’ve been struggling to find the good
                  Cops who are stepping up to help change this system. There seem to be very few of them and far between.

                  When more states get rid of qualified immunity like NY just did, things might change. I could see cops sued back to the Stone Age for their failure to take action against criminal cops.
                  Unfortunately when they do speak up against bad cops, they are the ones who get vilified. That protective culture has to stop for things to get better but it's gone on for so long it won't happen over night (if ever?). The union also has too much impact on policing the police.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    He had been carrying one and there were reports of gunfire in the area, but he threw the gun away from his body and put his hands up. He complied, his hands were empty, and the cop still shot him.

                    Why do the police and prosecutors keep thinking this won't eventually get out to the public? They wouldn't be vilified so much if they'd stop protecting bad cops. Does anyone really think the cop in last week's MN incident - a 20+ year veteran on the force - couldn't tell the difference between a taser and her service weapon? Again, the victim was no angel but did he deserve to die?
                    he was carrying a gun- felony
                    he didnt comply he ran
                    he tried to hide evidence_ throwing the gun
                    and all this happened at 230 am in an alley in a few seconds- you dont get to monday morning QB this 3 seconds before he got shot he was holding a weapon

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      He had been carrying one and there were reports of gunfire in the area, but he threw the gun away from his body and put his hands up. He complied, his hands were empty, and the cop still shot him.

                      Why do the police and prosecutors keep thinking this won't eventually get out to the public? They wouldn't be vilified so much if they'd stop protecting bad cops. Does anyone really think the cop in last week's MN incident - a 20+ year veteran on the force - couldn't tell the difference between a taser and her service weapon? Again, the victim was no angel but did he deserve to die?
                      very easy not to die at the hands of the police

                      dont resist arrest, be compliant with their instructions, and move slowly

                      they dont know anything about you, so they will err on the side of their safety
                      probably not running with a gun in a dark alley in the middle of the night would be safer

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        very easy not to die at the hands of the police

                        dont resist arrest, be compliant with their instructions, and move slowly

                        they dont know anything about you, so they will err on the side of their safety
                        probably not running with a gun in a dark alley in the middle of the night would be safer
                        Kid had his hands in the air, had already tossed the gun. He was complying, cop shot him anyway. Cops always go for the kill shot too, as if shooting a 13 year old in the leg wouldn't have slowed him down?

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          he was carrying a gun- felony
                          he didnt comply he ran
                          he tried to hide evidence_ throwing the gun
                          and all this happened at 230 am in an alley in a few seconds- you dont get to monday morning QB this 3 seconds before he got shot he was holding a weapon
                          He was unarmed. It's right there in the video. Even the city has had to back peddle their original claims. And how typical a con move - blame the victim. No one said he was angel but refuse to see what the cop did was wrong

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            Kid had his hands in the air, had already tossed the gun. He was complying, cop shot him anyway. Cops always go for the kill shot too, as if shooting a 13 year old in the leg wouldn't have slowed him down?
                            Until we know 100% that he had a gun and tossed it, we should even avoid repeating that “party line.” Police have a fairly extensive history of planting weapons at scenes like this.

                            Don’t know what happened here one way or another. The vid the police released claiming it showed a gun doesnt show that at all IMHO.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              He was unarmed. It's right there in the video. Even the city has had to back peddle their original claims. And how typical a con move - blame the victim. No one said he was angel but refuse to see what the cop did was wrong
                              There is a reason for “hands up, don’t shoot” but still they shoot

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                                Kid had his hands in the air, had already tossed the gun. He was complying, cop shot him anyway. Cops always go for the kill shot too, as if shooting a 13 year old in the leg wouldn't have slowed him down?
                                he tried to hide the fact that he tossed the gun by tossing it as he turned to put his hands up...there was no way for the officer to know that he had already tossed it...he turned and threw his hands up from being at his side...it is a tragedy that this happened but based on the prior actions(his buddy was shooting at a passing car) and the way he apparently discarded the gun I believe they will not determine that the officer's action was justified

                                Comment

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