How other MLS teams structure their Academies

[Unregistered]

Professionals....the top of the pyramid are not all identified at the youth ages. There is no country or system that can identify the chosen few and train only them. Identification is very imprecise. So the development net has to be cast fairly wide, with many more kids trained well, playing a lot on their own, and eventually ending on the top of the pyramid.

In the US kids play a fair amount until middle school. Recess, pickup, town, club, odp, clinics and summer camps etc give plenty of time on the ball. And the kids at this age that put the time in are pretty darn talented, arguably equal with their overseas peers. Then it changes. Right when other countries are ramping up expectations we dial them back. Many of our best players begin to have less time on the ball the older they get and the further up the development pyramid they climb. Clubs are incentivized to get kids into colleges, and attract the next group of u-littles to keep the wheels of commerce rolling. Parents and players shift focus from improving at the sport they love, to benefiting from it in the form of college scholarships, admissions help, etc. Soccer is now secondary.

Until we find a way, within the constraints of the US system, to keep a huge swath of players motivated to participate and improve their skills and techniques through the crucial teen years, the results when compared to true soccer countries will remain disappointing.

You are just 100% wrong with your assessment. It's just completely out of touch with what is happening not only in this country but in others as well. 99% of professional athletes NOW are absolutely being identified and segmented by 12-13 years old, you are just too cemented in your archaic views to see it. The only ones who aren't' identified that young are extreme outliers and there are just not anywhere near enough of them to base building a country's development system on. Heck its not even a universal truth that schools have recess any longer so a lot of your formula would actually mean starting the process earlier and doing a lot more in terms of basic athletic skill development simply because kids don't develop them naturally through their play like they did years ago. It's one of the ramifications of cutting back on things like gym and recess but also the fact that kids don't generally go out and "run around" like they did back in the day. The actual way to do this is by casting a much wider net at the wee kickers levels and putting much more structure in there. That absolutely will have negative consequences like earlier burn out but this country ultimately needs a much broader base for many of the reasons you cite. You are not going to overcome those issues by waiting.

[Unregistered]

Agreed. The DA should really reduce the max roster size limit. What they are doing with the U12s is perfect, rosters of 24 divided into two teams of 12 for games, 9v9 with three subs. Every kid on those rosters is going to get enough playing time for proper development.

Unfortunately, most of the U13 teams have 20 on their rosters for 11v11 games. Sure, you might have a couple playing up with the U14s, but could also have some U12s playing up with the 13s. With rosters of that size, you are going to have some players with much less than adequate playing time for optimum development. You would think at least the bottom three on the roster would be designated as DPs, so they could get playing time elsewhere, but a quick look at a bunch of rosters shows that almost all the players are FT, so the system is not really being used correctly.

A 20 man roster is too large for U13 for sure. It's too bad.

[Unregistered]

Agreed. The DA should really reduce the max roster size limit. What they are doing with the U12s is perfect, rosters of 24 divided into two teams of 12 for games, 9v9 with three subs. Every kid on those rosters is going to get enough playing time for proper development.

Unfortunately, most of the U13 teams have 20 on their rosters for 11v11 games. Sure, you might have a couple playing up with the U14s, but could also have some U12s playing up with the 13s. With rosters of that size, you are going to have some players with much less than adequate playing time for optimum development. You would think at least the bottom three on the roster would be designated as DPs, so they could get playing time elsewhere, but a quick look at a bunch of rosters shows that almost all the players are FT, so the system is not really being used correctly.

Realistically they should abandon the concept of teams and focus on the pool of players and only break them into teams for competitions which should be deemphasized in importance.

[Unregistered]

Another way to accomplish the goal is to split DA into 2 tiers. Mandate all MLS DA teams run residential academies or practice a minimum 5 days a week, provide nutrition, fitness, and other development- training benefits to all its players. Allow non-MLS to do a bit less, but certainly more than currently occurs.

This way we are correcting the current deficiencies for many more players, and raising the standard of play for those that will end on the top of the pyramid, as well as those a notch or so down. Raising the skill levels and technical standard of play across a huge swath of players would pay huge dividends later when these players are coaches and parents of the next generation.

[Unregistered]

Strongly agree with the poster in #64. The thesis that has been allowed to become a virus on this site thanks to one very special poster -- the idea that the "greats" are ruined by the dreadfully inferior rec players they have to step on a pitch with -- is just ludicrous on its face, but unfortunately has a grain of traction simply because it is repeated all day, every day.

You cannot build a youth system solely with the idea of what that will do for the 3 players every 5 years who have a small to decent chance to make a real national team. No other sport works that way either. Not one. If you're an elite anything, you don't get anywhere by complaining that the next best players in your surrounding towns or quadrant of the state aren't good enough to challenge you (or that those kids simply shouldn't play at all if they can't be fully in the service of maybe helping someone, some day make a national team). An elite tennis player from Georgia doesn't get anywhere by criticizing all the other tennis players in Georgia. They simply stop playing tournaments in GA or even just in the Southeast if they need national-level competition. Blaming everyone else is just bizarre. If the point is just to let us know that our kids aren't so good, we get it. No further reminders needed.

[Unregistered]

A 20 man roster is too large for U13 for sure. It's too bad.

And many have up to 22+ for older ages, yet only 18 can roster on game day. Add the substitution rules and some players hardly ever play outside of the required minimum starts. Granted those players aren't NT or pro level players. But if that's they case why are they in the system in the first place? Oh yeah - to be practice cones for the few players USSF and clubs care about, and to pay for the program at non MLS clubs.

[Unregistered]

Strongly agree with the poster in #64. The thesis that has been allowed to become a virus on this site thanks to one very special poster -- the idea that the "greats" are ruined by the dreadfully inferior rec players they have to step on a pitch with -- is just ludicrous on its face, but unfortunately has a grain of traction simply because it is repeated all day, every day.

You cannot build a youth system solely with the idea of what that will do for the 3 players every 5 years who have a small to decent chance to make a real national team. No other sport works that way either. Not one. If you're an elite anything, you don't get anywhere by complaining that the next best players in your surrounding towns or quadrant of the state aren't good enough to challenge you (or that those kids simply shouldn't play at all if they can't be fully in the service of maybe helping someone, some day make a national team). An elite tennis player from Georgia doesn't get anywhere by criticizing all the other tennis players in Georgia. They simply stop playing tournaments in GA or even just in the Southeast if they need national-level competition. Blaming everyone else is just bizarre. If the point is just to let us know that our kids aren't so good, we get it. No further reminders needed.

Well, I'm glad you got that off your chest.

[Unregistered]

And many have up to 22+ for older ages, yet only 18 can roster on game day. Add the substitution rules and some players hardly ever play outside of the required minimum starts. Granted those players aren't NT or pro level players. But if that's they case why are they in the system in the first place? Oh yeah - to be practice cones for the few players USSF and clubs care about, and to pay for the program at non MLS clubs.

I am very curious (not looking forward, per se, and maybe dreading) to see how the spring season will shape up as far as U14's moving to U15/U16 games at the Revs. The U15/U16 roster seems to have sprouted since the fall. 24 players? I don't recall the roster having so many players on it in the fall.

[Unregistered]

I am very curious (not looking forward, per se, and maybe dreading) to see how the spring season will shape up as far as U14's moving to U15/U16 games at the Revs. The U15/U16 roster seems to have sprouted since the fall. 24 players? I don't recall the roster having so many players on it in the fall.

Some will play up which relieves some of the pressure, but certainly not all. Lots of players won't play in a meaningful way

[Unregistered]

If you talk to the back line and GK about the required start rule you will hear how annoying it is. Or when the back line has to have required starts sub in key matches. DA should be the elite league in the USA for the best players, pure and simple. If a club has to bring in fillers, then they need to partner with a boarding school or homestay and get recruiting. This is what MLS clubs are doing...why dont other clubs. It already is getting tough to pick a club...past record prevails. If they are notoriously at the bottom of the bracket, why would a player at this level choose that club. I think more and more clubs should be knocked out of DA.

[Unregistered]

Strongly agree with the poster in #64. The thesis that has been allowed to become a virus on this site thanks to one very special poster -- the idea that the "greats" are ruined by the dreadfully inferior rec players they have to step on a pitch with -- is just ludicrous on its face, but unfortunately has a grain of traction simply because it is repeated all day, every day.

You cannot build a youth system solely with the idea of what that will do for the 3 players every 5 years who have a small to decent chance to make a real national team. No other sport works that way either. Not one.

Your post is a little off topic right now, but I actually think that striving to build a youth system where you treat all players, starting from the ages of 6 years old, as if they will grow up to play for the NT is just the thing to do. Get the youngest players top coaches and teach them real skills early on. Believe it or not, kids have more fun when coaches actually know what they are doing and they see themselves as improving, instead of just running around in the bee swarm. They'll also stick with soccer for longer, if it's more challenging and fun (my kid almost quit soccer because rec practices were so boring, moved him to club and he's still playing four years later).

Then, by U9/U10 or so, kids can start peeling off into Rec or Competitive, depending on their interest and commitment level. Raising the level of all players at the youngest ages will keep players in the system longer and will raise the level of the top players as they get to YNT ages.

[Unregistered]

And if USSoccer makes it mandatory for DA players to have their soccer fee waived, then you'll see how quickly rosters will shrink to the best players and clubs will have other teams for development players, like NPL teams.

[Unregistered]

You are just 100% wrong with your assessment. It's just completely out of touch with what is happening not only in this country but in others as well. 99% of professional athletes NOW are absolutely being identified and segmented by 12-13 years old, you are just too cemented in your archaic views to see it.

The New England Patriots are living proof you have no effing idea what you're talking about.

[Unregistered]

You are just 100% wrong with your assessment. It's just completely out of touch with what is happening not only in this country but in others as well. 99% of professional athletes NOW are absolutely being identified and segmented by 12-13 years old, you are just too cemented in your archaic views to see it. The only ones who aren't' identified that young are extreme outliers and there are just not anywhere near enough of them to base building a country's development system on. Heck its not even a universal truth that schools have recess any longer so a lot of your formula would actually mean starting the process earlier and doing a lot more in terms of basic athletic skill development simply because kids don't develop them naturally through their play like they did years ago. It's one of the ramifications of cutting back on things like gym and recess but also the fact that kids don't generally go out and "run around" like they did back in the day. The actual way to do this is by casting a much wider net at the wee kickers levels and putting much more structure in there. That absolutely will have negative consequences like earlier burn out but this country ultimately needs a much broader base for many of the reasons you cite. You are not going to overcome those issues by waiting.

Go read "The Sports Gene" and then come back here and tell us 99% of athletes are identified and segmented by 12/13. Here's one for you: 99% of statistics are made up BS. Many boys haven't gone through their AGS at 12/13 and you think anyone can tell anything about them before that? There are plenty of outliers that go through growth spurts at 16-19 as well. If they are still developing physically and mentally then you don't have 99% certainty in anything.

[Unregistered]

And if USSoccer makes it mandatory for DA players to have their soccer fee waived, then you'll see how quickly rosters will shrink to the best players and clubs will have other teams for development players, like NPL teams.

Is this happening? It would be great.