Fall OYSA Results - Boys and Girls

[Unregistered]

League titles by club. Can see on OYSA site other than u11s (which only technical staffs can see):

BOYS
UPDX - 8
Bend - 3
Pacific, Santos, FC - 2
FCSC, Corvallis, SESC,THUSC, SSC, PCU, FSC, NYS, Cuervos, LYS - 1

GIRLS
UPDX - 4
Pacific - 3
Westside, FCSC, Woodburn - 2
FC, OPFC, THELO, UUSC, WUFC, OFA, CUSC, NWUSA, WA. Timbers - 1

[Unregistered]

You really count non-Premier divisions as a "league title"? If a team didn't win the top Premier division, they didn't win the league.

[Unregistered]

League titles by club. Can see on OYSA site other than u11s (which only technical staffs can see):

BOYS
UPDX - 8
Bend - 3
Pacific, Santos, FC - 2
FCSC, Corvallis, SESC,THUSC, SSC, PCU, FSC, NYS, Cuervos, LYS - 1

GIRLS
UPDX - 4
Pacific - 3
Westside, FCSC, Woodburn - 2
FC, OPFC, THELO, UUSC, WUFC, OFA, CUSC, NWUSA, WA. Timbers - 1

Seriously?

Apparently you haven't been here very long, and don't know the rules. Rule#3 is: we don't discuss results in non-premier leagues. Nobody cares that your club won President's Cup, or finish first in division 1 blue south.

A beer says this is a updx honk, proud of his club's twelve titles, but only two of which were in premier green or gold. And individual teams should be proud, certainly. But any club that focuses on lower division titles is focusing on the wrong thing, and one that cleans up down there is probably mis-seeding (or worse, deliberately sandbagging) its teams.

[Unregistered]

Seriously?

Apparently you haven't been here very long, and don't know the rules. Rule#3 is: we don't discuss results in non-premier leagues. Nobody cares that your club won President's Cup, or finish first in division 1 blue south.

A beer says this is a updx honk, proud of his club's twelve titles, but only two of which were in premier green or gold. And individual teams should be proud, certainly. But any club that focuses on lower division titles is focusing on the wrong thing, and one that cleans up down there is probably mis-seeding (or worse, deliberately sandbagging) its teams.

You are right - proud of progress in last year.

Even if you filter for just premier, it is still a good progress.

[Unregistered]

No ADF?

Thought they were the best in all of Oregon , and most certainly better than the DA teams

[Unregistered]

Seriously?

Apparently you haven't been here very long, and don't know the rules. Rule#3 is: we don't discuss results in non-premier leagues. Nobody cares that your club won President's Cup, or finish first in division 1 blue south.

A beer says this is a updx honk, proud of his club's twelve titles, but only two of which were in premier green or gold. And individual teams should be proud, certainly. But any club that focuses on lower division titles is focusing on the wrong thing, and one that cleans up down there is probably mis-seeding (or worse, deliberately sandbagging) its teams.

Jealousy is an ugly emotion.

[Unregistered]

Jealousy is an ugly emotion.

Don't the Timbers DA field squads at 07 & 06? Gutting the usual suspect clubs of their game changers for a few years, once these kids get spit back to their club of origin normalcy returns at the HS Ages. Seems to be the cycle of life in the club scene over the last decade.

Talking about how clubs did across 6 to 8 tiers of quasi recreational/classic leagues this fall is not worth much since clubs elect which tier they will play in the OYSA, just by raising their hand. If you sign up for a 6th division league and your a 3rd division level congrats on taking the league.

Decoding the con.

Next.

[Unregistered]

No ADF?

Thought they were the best in all of Oregon , and most certainly better than the DA teams

They play in the Brazilian league against the worlds best. No time for your Mickey Mouse league.

[Unregistered]

They play in the Brazilian league against the worlds best. No time for your Mickey Mouse league.

And you thought those weekend drives to Medford were tough. The slums and favelas of São Paulo don't even have an in n out or Harry and David to make it worth the trip!

[Unregistered]

Seriously?

Apparently you haven't been here very long, and don't know the rules. Rule#3 is: we don't discuss results in non-premier leagues. Nobody cares that your club won President's Cup, or finish first in division 1 blue south.

A beer says this is a updx honk, proud of his club's twelve titles, but only two of which were in premier green or gold. And individual teams should be proud, certainly. But any club that focuses on lower division titles is focusing on the wrong thing, and one that cleans up down there is probably mis-seeding (or worse, deliberately sandbagging) its teams.

you are right. League titles are one way to measure success. What other ways do clubs measure success? Is it the mission of UPDX to win as many titles as possible? What else do they look to do to be successful?

[Unregistered]

you are right. League titles are one way to measure success. What other ways do clubs measure success? Is it the mission of UPDX to win as many titles as possible? What else do they look to do to be successful?

If you are the DoC (or any of the coaches), and honest with yourself, you know how your players have improved. Probably the ultimate success of a team or coach is that--the kids get better.

But most teams/coaches don't bother with the documentation thereof--written evaluations of players, and other things that are commonly found in other educational environments. Coaches, after all, are teachers--teachers of the game, and like all teachers, teachers of life.

And even if they did, a lot of this is private, and amenable to book-cooking were it to become the basis of a publicity campaign.

So yes, win/loss records do become a proxy for success--"we win the most games" and "we have the most trophies" can easily be trumpeted, and many people will be fooled into think that ergo, "we have the best coaching staff and curriculum" is also true.

And in the world of nonprofit youth soccer, attracting kids is the lifeblood of a club. The damage done to a club if one of its teams folds (due to lack of players) is immense, and so some clubs engage in some increasingly cutthroat tactics to get players from other clubs to switch (cough ODP cough). The problem is that recruiting becomes the focus of the club, and that winning rather than teaching becomes paramount. Clubs concentrate on identifying and "poaching" players from other clubs, rather than developing the promising kids they have on their own rosters. And in some cases, dubious behavior such as seeding B/C teams too low (so they can clean up in Division 1, when they would be better challenged in Premier, even if they would finish bottom of the table) results--this is one reason why we have a cultural norm here about NOT discussing the results of non-premier leagues. It's not because we're arrogant pr*cks who consider such talk beneath us, it's because placing competitive pressure on lower-level teams invariably leads to bad behavior.

The mission of UPDX should be to teach the game. The club, and its predecessors (BSC and NEU) have some great kids that have been there a long time, who have developed nicely. But since the merger, the vast majority of the success the club has enjoyed seems to be due to players who were recruited from elsewhere and weren't at NEU or BSC pre-merger, and quite a bit from "UPDX South". They deserve credit for what they are doing, certainly, but as Obama said a while ago--you didn't build that.

[Unregistered]

Don't the Timbers DA field squads at 07 & 06? Gutting the usual suspect clubs of their game changers for a few years, once these kids get spit back to their club of origin normalcy returns at the HS Ages. Seems to be the cycle of life in the club scene over the last decade.

Talking about how clubs did across 6 to 8 tiers of quasi recreational/classic leagues this fall is not worth much since clubs elect which tier they will play in the OYSA, just by raising their hand. If you sign up for a 6th division league and your a 3rd division level congrats on taking the league.

Decoding the con.

Next.

UPDX has got this figured out.

1) They will, of course, make damn sure that the Timbers don't get anywhere near any of their own prospects. Participation in RTC/ODP will be discouraged, families will be told by the coaches just how terrible the Timbers Academy is, etc. They may not go the full ADF and threaten families who attend Timbers' functions on their own, but unlike the Alliance clubs, there will be NO cooperation with the Timbers.

2) Every spring, when the Timbers make their cuts, bulk offers of spots will be made to the kids who are cut. (Most other clubs take the position that ex-TA players have to try out, like anyone else; there may be a few local clubs that go further and essentially blacklist anyone who leaves for the Timbers). And since the TA castoffs are unlikely to include any former UPDX kids (see #1), many parents of such kids will eagerly accept such offers so they don't have to endure the humiliation of returning to the old team. (The kids probably won't care as much, but I know quite a few parents for whom going back to the old club would be unthinkable).

[Unregistered]

The mission of UPDX should be to teach the game. The club, and its predecessors (BSC and NEU) have some great kids that have been there a long time, who have developed nicely. But since the merger, the vast majority of the success the club has enjoyed seems to be due to players who were recruited from elsewhere and weren't at NEU or BSC pre-merger, and quite a bit from "UPDX South". They deserve credit for what they are doing, certainly, but as Obama said a while ago--you didn't build that.

I'm sure that the kids at UPDX on those teams that did win the premier leagues would definitely take issue with that "vast majority" statement. The core of those teams - the rock solid players that are leaders on those teams - have been winning and losing with NEU and BSC since they were in rec as tiny tots. To say that their success is due to recruiting is completely demeaning to the hard work those kids have put into that club for years. Show me ONE CLUB out there that hasn't changed its top roster over time due to kids moving/club hops/natural attrition to other sports (I know there are none in the 06/07/08 premier OYSA leagues). They just do not exist.

So please stop with the BS that UPDX is only good because they recruit. It's simply not true. And every club recruits/markets because they need players to survive. Whether your definition of recruiting is a DOC or coach being out there asking about talented players or whether it's just parents sharing that they are happy where their kids are - it happens everywhere. And kids (and parents) want to go where teams are enjoying some success AND the kids are learning and developing. As long as that is happening where you are, don't rain on others' parade. Be THANKFUL, this week especially, that you can be happy for your child's growth, development and love of the game.

[Unregistered]

UPDX has got this figured out.

1) They will, of course, make damn sure that the Timbers don't get anywhere near any of their own prospects. Participation in RTC/ODP will be discouraged, families will be told by the coaches just how terrible the Timbers Academy is, etc. They may not go the full ADF and threaten families who attend Timbers' functions on their own, but unlike the Alliance clubs, there will be NO cooperation with the Timbers.

2) Every spring, when the Timbers make their cuts, bulk offers of spots will be made to the kids who are cut. (Most other clubs take the position that ex-TA players have to try out, like anyone else; there may be a few local clubs that go further and essentially blacklist anyone who leaves for the Timbers). And since the TA castoffs are unlikely to include any former UPDX kids (see #1), many parents of such kids will eagerly accept such offers so they don't have to endure the humiliation of returning to the old team. (The kids probably won't care as much, but I know quite a few parents for whom going back to the old club would be unthinkable).

This is laughably uninformed. UPDX kids have been training with and playing for TA for several years, including this year. UPDX does not discourage TA and they do not hold it against the players that take advantage of those opportunities, should their kids be lucky enough to be invited. There were at least 8-9 UPDX players at the Discovery Program in November and that was just one age group.

And if they discourage RTC/ODP, it's because that program is low level/non-competitive soccer. Have had a kid in both and it's not for top talent. So nice try, but you are wrong.

[Unregistered]

I'm sure that the kids at UPDX on those teams that did win the premier leagues would definitely take issue with that "vast majority" statement. The core of those teams - the rock solid players that are leaders on those teams - have been winning and losing with NEU and BSC since they were in rec as tiny tots. To say that their success is due to recruiting is completely demeaning to the hard work those kids have put into that club for years. Show me ONE CLUB out there that hasn't changed its top roster over time due to kids moving/club hops/natural attrition to other sports (I know there are none in the 06/07/08 premier OYSA leagues). They just do not exist.

So please stop with the BS that UPDX is only good because they recruit. It's simply not true. And every club recruits/markets because they need players to survive. Whether your definition of recruiting is a DOC or coach being out there asking about talented players or whether it's just parents sharing that they are happy where their kids are - it happens everywhere. And kids (and parents) want to go where teams are enjoying some success AND the kids are learning and developing. As long as that is happening where you are, don't rain on others' parade. Be THANKFUL, this week especially, that you can be happy for your child's growth, development and love of the game.

Lots of the longstanding members of BSC that I know are offended... that the new management essentially went out and got new teams at many age groups. Nothing I should say should be intended as disrespect to the kids who played for many years at NEU and BSC, many of which found themselves, post-merger, on the bench or the B team. Roster turnover does happen, but it's been particularly aggressive at one club.

And lets be honest. UPDX's recent success (even though they failed to win a State Cup last year, they suddenly had a top 2-3 boys team at every sub-HS age group but 05, and a top 2-3 team at 04 and 01) was not organic development, nor explainable by simply combining two clubs and re-picking the A team from the A teams that were there previously. There was a lot of recruiting that went on, some of it underhanded, and many of the players that were leading UPDX deep in the State Cup were NOT kids who were playing for BSC or NEU the way before.

After all, the quick way to get wins is to recruit. Timbers seem to believe that, as they would rather spend $10M signing South American cokeheads than properly funding their academy. (And I'm sure the loss of the transfer fee for Brian Fernandez, given that Nexaca apparently is telling MLS and the Timbers to chinga tu madre, por favor now that they want some of that money back, will be used as an excuse for all sorts of thing by the Peregrine front office for years to come). And even the clubs in town that do seem willing to play the long game with kids, will eagerly supplement rosters if they can get away with, better if the player comes from a rival. Training kids takes time, most kids have ceilings that are below State Cup level, and the other teams are busy training their kids too. "It's Not About the X's and the O's It's All About the Jimmy's and the Joe's" has long been a popular bit of wisdom in American football, particularly at the collegiate level.

Be honest, UPDX. You want to be the alpha club in town, and are busy pushing the envelope to find ways to get the top-performing kids in black shirts. Many of those kids didn't play for BSC or NEU. You think this is bloodsport, and all's fair. We understand.

But don't pretend it's anything else.