Playing Time

[Unregistered]

yes, you pegged me - this was our first go-around in Club World, so I had no clue. Also, I'm not a soccer guy, so I had no idea about her true abilities/weaknesses. I remember asking her at least 4 or 5 times 'do you REALLY want to do this' before I contacted the coach to agree to join. I had a bad feeling about it from the get-go, and like you mention, I got a slick salesman-vibe from the coach. About midway through this past U15 season, I actually had a couple of parents of the better/best players on the team approach me and say you need to get her off this team because you're wasting your money here and she's not going to get better watching the games. I'm just so happy she got back up on the horse and did HS this season.

Lesson learned. Glad it worked out. It's a big relief when you do see them finally happy again.

[Unregistered]

Lesson learned. Glad it worked out. It's a big relief when you do see them finally happy again.

thanks, I'm just glad that the memories (ours and hers) will now be of playing the game (albeit at a lower JV and town level) rather than sitting there watching other people's kids playing.

[Unregistered]

As someone who lived it for 2 years, I’ll warn other parents to be very careful with a little-or-no-playing-time situation. My kid was an ok town player and absolutely loved the game, but she’s the type of kid who recognizes her weaknesses and that she’s no superstar. She was very enthusiastic about trying out for a premier U14 club in the area, made the club, and then……..sat. She had very good training attendance and she’s not the kind of kid to give a coach any problems or make waves, but was lucky to see 10-15 minutes a game. Some games she never even saw the field. I gently approached the coach on this, and was given a litany of excuses, the main one being that she’s not that good (then why is she on your team???). Against my better judgment, my kid wanted to try a second year of this fiasco. I had a sliver of hope things would get better, but it was even less playing time (the U15 roster was bigger than the previous year, so even less minutes to go around). I think she actually regressed as a player during the 2 years – the trainings were very good and I think her skills got stronger, but due to the complete lack of game experience, she regressed as a field player. By the middle of the U15 season, she told me he’d had enough and I could see she was quite down on herself and the game in general. We doubted she’d even play HS soccer this year, as she was openly saying she wouldn’t right up until about a week before practices started. Anyway, she’s playing HS (JV) and she’s more like his old self, just having fun with it and smiling more. Most importantly, she’s getting real minutes on the field, making mistakes and learning. I think premier has a place for a special child/talent, but it can ruin a kid too, you have to be very careful with these clubs and you also have to be brutally honest with yourself about your child’s abilities. I still rue the day she ever set foot in that tryout. Like others have said, I’ll repeat it: if you’re afraid to go to the restroom because you’re afraid you’ll miss your kid’s 10 minutes of game time, don’t buy the “development” BS they spin, get out of Dodge as quickly as possible. The longer it goes on, the more likely you’ll end up crushing your kid’s love of this game. Been there, Done that.

Outstanding post. A reality for far more parents than are probably willing to acknowledge. And not just playing time specifically, but the overpromising of development and the failure to develop physically and emotionally fit athletes who love to play and learn from the game.

It's a business people. Forget that at your own risk.

[Unregistered]

The club advertises that they offer the best development and the contract says that the club will develop. If you take that to a court, the verdict would be based on the definition of development and a coach would be hard pressed to ever say that playtime in games was not a significant part of development.

Yes...keep the stopwatch out and make sure your kid, or, if you are the coach, the kids get significant playing time.
Yes...the OP did highlight a younger age where this is an absolute necessity.
However, this applies to all ages. Unless you can tell me that physical, mental, and skill development plateau at age 12 then playtime has to be go until at least age 15/16. Personally, I would even go beyond since development goes beyond that. As important, at this age is, assuming that the kid might want to play college ball, that coaches won't see you if you are on the bench and you don't get much of a rhythm or a chance to touch the ball if you are in for only 5-15 minutes.

There is also the concept of quality minutes. Development occurs when you are part of the game. If you are just running around and not getting any or many touches on the ball then you are not gaining much development. In fact, the one, especially at the younger ages, who developes most, while annoying everyone else, is the ball hog. This is the one who ultimately has the best skill.

Quality playtime is a must. Any coach/club who tells you otherwise and practices otherwise is a con-man...or woman. Rosters that have 20-23 for a 11 v 11 game is a joke unless they are playing 30+ games and there is a guarantee that your kid will start more than 30-40% and play more than 40% of any given game. The rules of the DAP are stupid!! 'Minimum starts of 20% and once you are subbed out you are out'. To hide behind the guise that they are readying the players for professional play is a cop-out. For 99% of the players college is the highest level they reach and subbing is pretty liberal.

Although many won't want to hear it, there, traditionally, have been few clubs that limit the roster and play the kids. Valeo was one and, yes.....Blazers. If training and playing are the goals then these clubs offer the opportunity. However, Valeo has gotten too big and Blazers have gone down in the competitive level category. All considered, you will be hard pressed to find training better than that offered by Okaroh.

Unless your kid is a top 12-15 player on a top team at one of the larger clubs, your kid might be better off with a smaller club and more opportunity.

[Unregistered]

Getting the roster size right can be a challenge. We're in a 9v9 environment right now. Last fall, 15 at each game, two teams. Too many.

Next season, they add a couple so their is now a total of 33, 3 teams. Sounds perfect, but one broken arm, another quits, sick/vactions take a couple of games here and there, and we're scrambling some games; often kids playing a couple a day with short subs (which is fine, doesn't seem to bother anyone). Better than having too many...but still makes the tournaments hard.

To me, getting a dedicated team who won't miss for Cindy's birthday party, family's Disney trip, etc. with 2-3 subs (9v9) or 3-4 (11v11) is a good roster size.

[Unregistered]

agree - in our case it doesn't have to be a full game, but if there's not substantial minutes in games, then your child is NOT developing, I don't care how good the trainings are. Not worth your (or your child's) time, and certainly not worth your hard-earned dollars. The nice thing about the Northeast is that there are typically several options all within a relatively sane driving distance, so vote with your feet and your pocketbook. And shame on any club that takes a child only to sit them for most of the games

Would it be better to accept a spot on a lower team and play most of the game then? We're struggling with that now. D. Moved from a higher team to a lower team. She was on the bubble. Now top 1-2 on her team. She's playing a lot more in games but says the training drills in practice are slower and not as complicated as with her other team.
Trying to decide if we should leave for another club with a team that is the equivalent of a half step up from where she is ( between the two teams at her club) but further to travel. She's U 14 and as of now not planning on playing in college.

[Unregistered]

Would it be better to accept a spot on a lower team and play most of the game then? We're struggling with that now. D. Moved from a higher team to a lower team. She was on the bubble. Now top 1-2 on her team. She's playing a lot more in games but says the training drills in practice are slower and not as complicated as with her other team.
Trying to decide if we should leave for another club with a team that is the equivalent of a half step up from where she is ( between the two teams at her club) but further to travel. She's U 14 and as of now not planning on playing in college.

I have 3 kids and they've had very mixed experiences, but parts of what you describe sounds a lot like one of them. What I've found is they need to be in a situation where they can enjoy playing, build confidence, but they've got to be motivated to do the work to get better. If you take one of those away, things can end poorly. Higher team or lower team, wins and losses, those things DO NOT MATTER if the training and individual development isn't there.

But show me a kid who is getting GREAT training, but is in over their head on a higher team, not getting minutes, and I'll show you a kid that will more than likely have their spirit and drive broken. There are too many alternatives for development, which is NOT some secret sauce, to be placed on a team that your kid really doesn't fit well with to the point of a coach not wanting to give meaningful minutes to during games.

[Unregistered]

Would it be better to accept a spot on a lower team and play most of the game then? We're struggling with that now. D. Moved from a higher team to a lower team. She was on the bubble. Now top 1-2 on her team. She's playing a lot more in games but says the training drills in practice are slower and not as complicated as with her other team.
Trying to decide if we should leave for another club with a team that is the equivalent of a half step up from where she is ( between the two teams at her club) but further to travel. She's U 14 and as of now not planning on playing in college.

Been there as well - current club's training not quite as good as the prior one but my son's soul was crushed at the prior club (dirt bag coach didn't help either). He's back to his happy, motivated self again. He goes out and trains in the yard by himself, looks up drills on-line, goes to the park and drills balls into a big net. At his most miserable he didn't even want to go to practices (headaches, stomach aches, homework....). He's certainly not thinking playing in college but I'm grateful he has his love of the game back. He just wants to play in HS, club could be a college option, and I can see him doing adult leagues as he gets older. He just loves the game (again)

He also wants to do some clinics over the winter - which is an option for you as well. Lots of clubs have clinics and camps that can supplement your club. You can also get together a few friends of similar skill level, hire a good trainer and split the costs.

[Unregistered]

As someone who lived it for 2 years, I’ll warn other parents to be very careful with a little-or-no-playing-time situation. My kid was an ok town player and absolutely loved the game, but she’s the type of kid who recognizes her weaknesses and that she’s no superstar. She was very enthusiastic about trying out for a premier U14 club in the area, made the club, and then……..sat. She had very good training attendance and she’s not the kind of kid to give a coach any problems or make waves, but was lucky to see 10-15 minutes a game. Some games she never even saw the field.

Wow, I've never been to a club game where a kid didn't play at all (except for rotating GKs). And I've been to hundreds of games from U10 to U18. That is just odd and not right.

[Unregistered]

Been there as well - current club's training not quite as good as the prior one but my son's soul was crushed at the prior club (dirt bag coach didn't help either). He's back to his happy, motivated self again. He goes out and trains in the yard by himself, looks up drills on-line, goes to the park and drills balls into a big net. At his most miserable he didn't even want to go to practices (headaches, stomach aches, homework....). He's certainly not thinking playing in college but I'm grateful he has his love of the game back. He just wants to play in HS, club could be a college option, and I can see him doing adult leagues as he gets older. He just loves the game (again)

He also wants to do some clinics over the winter - which is an option for you as well. Lots of clubs have clinics and camps that can supplement your club. You can also get together a few friends of similar skill level, hire a good trainer and split the costs.

We did the opposite with my kid this year. Last year he was at a smaller club where he was the best on the team. He played almost every minute of every game, not just because of skill level, but because the roster size only allowed for one sub and most of the time there was at least one no show. The kids weren't really that motivated, small turn out for practices, so there wasn't a lot of development going on as a team.

This year, he's at a bigger club, but is now one of the weakest players on the team (birth year change was really tough on him, as well). Even though he's only getting about 50% playing time, he's so much happier after this first month than he was last year. He's playing with kids that are committed and enjoying the team, along with much more intense and challenging training. Plus, the realization that he has some catching up to do to get to the level of the kids a school year above him, has really motivated him to practice and try harder so he won't be the weak link. The loss of playing time hasn't bothered him so far, but hopefully he'll remain at 50%, and maybe he'll even get some extra time towards the end of the season as he puts in the work and improves.

[Unregistered]

Wow, I've never been to a club game where a kid didn't play at all (except for rotating GKs). And I've been to hundreds of games from U10 to U18. That is just odd and not right.

I'm the person who posted it - it was horrendous to live through. I can't even imagine what my kid felt like inside, I just know it was horrendous as a parent. It wasn't just my kid, he kept 2-3 kids total at those types of minutes over the two seasons we were there. We have friends on other clubs and they said the same thing, that it's not how their club works and we need to bail out, which we did.

[Unregistered]

The teamwork aspect of sports in general, the experience of playing and competing in games, and the social experience for the child (especially young girls in my opinion) are the only compelling reasons to play (and pay for) club soccer. None of those benefits are really soccer-specific by the way (other than playing in matches), you could experience them for a fraction of the cost in any number of other activities.

So certainly for any parent whose kid is in a situation where minutes are absurdly low, your money would be much better spent on private training and playing town soccer and other sports. They could develop more quickly and proficiently within an individual coach investing the same or slightly less time and much less money.

[Unregistered]

I'm the person who posted it - it was horrendous to live through. I can't even imagine what my kid felt like inside, I just know it was horrendous as a parent. It wasn't just my kid, he kept 2-3 kids total at those types of minutes over the two seasons we were there. We have friends on other clubs and they said the same thing, that it's not how their club works and we need to bail out, which we did.

That's terrible, must have been a long 2 years. You might be apprehensive about indicating which club it was, but it would sure help us avoid them in the future.

[Unregistered]

We did the opposite with my kid this year. Last year he was at a smaller club where he was the best on the team. He played almost every minute of every game, not just because of skill level, but because the roster size only allowed for one sub and most of the time there was at least one no show. The kids weren't really that motivated, small turn out for practices, so there wasn't a lot of development going on as a team.

This year, he's at a bigger club, but is now one of the weakest players on the team (birth year change was really tough on him, as well). Even though he's only getting about 50% playing time, he's so much happier after this first month than he was last year. He's playing with kids that are committed and enjoying the team, along with much more intense and challenging training. Plus, the realization that he has some catching up to do to get to the level of the kids a school year above him, has really motivated him to practice and try harder so he won't be the weak link. The loss of playing time hasn't bothered him so far, but hopefully he'll remain at 50%, and maybe he'll even get some extra time towards the end of the season as he puts in the work and improves.

Be grateful for the 50%. At plenty of clubs a player in his position would be lucky to get 25%. I've seen it at the many clubs we've been at over the years (multiple kids play) and one with my own kids. It's hard to watch for any player, let alone your own (in our case the coach got canned days before my kid was ready to quit the sport altogether. He was all state last year lol) .

[Unregistered]

That's terrible, must have been a long 2 years. You might be apprehensive about indicating which club it was, but it would sure help us avoid them in the future.

I really don't feel comfortable. It's a smaller club in CT, so you Mass folks don't need to worry.