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?? For parents of HS Jr. And Sr. Boys

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    #31
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    For D2, just look at the Northeast 10 Conference to see the "local" schools- as stated, sounds like there are more than some people think. Hard to general on where they sit academically vis-à-vis D3 since there are so many D3 schools locally. Certainly most highly regarded D3 schools are considered superior academically to most D2 schools, but gets harder to generalize after that. A couple of observations about D2 mens soccer (as it occurs in the northeast- New England and NY)- 1. Academically- The NCAA clearing house standards for D2 are lower than for D1. But there are kids who can't pass the D2 standards, and those kids then sometimes go to play D3 (which has no NCAA clearance requirement)- so take that you D3 snobs. 2. Players- Just like in D1, the schools can grant athletic scholarships (almost as may as D1), and some do and some don't. Some schools have a pretty heavy concentration of foreign players (who you'd expect are getting the scholarship $), and you see a decent number of graduate students on some rosters. But it's really a mix- some schools look to be made up of mostly local kids on a traditional college route, and some are heavily weighted towards foreign and older players who may not be on a traditional college path.
    Take University of Bridgeport (CT) as an example. Their women's team just made the final four. Decent number of foreign players and locals and the coach I think is from the UK. But it's a so-so school in Bridgeport - not a great neighborhood. So good soccer but the school is a tough sell to many people (including my kid who didn't care for the school but liked the coach).

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      #32
      ID Camps

      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      What ID Camps would you recommend?
      Sorry; haven't been back in a while! The ID camps are expensive, so my son used to look at the coaching staff for each one, pick the ones that gave him the "most bang for the buck," and register for those.

      He had a lot of success at Collegiate Soccer Academy (at Lasell) and Peak Performance (at Amherst) the summers before his junior and senior years. (Mostly coaches he was already "talking" to, but a couple of serious recruiting efforts to schools he seriously considered were initiated at those camps, too.)

      Of course, he also went to a handful of 1-2 day ID camps (1-2 per year, starting junior spring) at specific schools he was interested in.

      Girls start ID camps much earlier. I have a friend whose daughter is only in 8th grade, already attending them! For my son, it would have been a complete waste of money in 9th or 10th grade. He has grown 8 inches and gained 80 lbs of muscle since 9th grade, so he would've been a boy competing among men.

      Hope this helps, and good luck...

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        #33
        I would say that all of this, not just the id camps, is expensive. The issue really comes down to one of efficiency so that what spend you get the most bang for your buck out of. The trick to using ID camps is picking ones where A) your child has a shot at being what the coach is looking for and B) your child might actually want to go to school. That is all about targeting. In order to target efficiently you need to have an idea where your kid might be able to play and they need to have a clue what a college decision is all about. Figuring that all out is no easy task but if you don't you'll end up on a hunting expedition ******* away money all over the place.

        Top level girls are actually being recruited in the 8th grade and committing in the 9th now. My take on the boys side is they trail them by a year. Because of early recruiting, what is going on now on both sides of the gender coin really requires that you start forecasting things a heck of a lot earlier than anyone is really comfortable with. In many ways it is completely insane but I think that you will find that if you wait until you have anywhere near a finished product to start thinking about colleges and playing for one of them that you will have missed the boat because the recruiting window will have closed by then.

        My advice is start early and slow getting your child into a frame of mind where they can even consider making a decision that early. It's no small feat and if they can't do it (it's rather abnormal if they can) then you might want to consider that soccer in college might not be in the cards or at least not a major factor in the decision. If your child is not ready, they are not ready. The absolute worst thing you can do is force all of this on a child who is not ready for it. If that is the case though then you really have the luxury of time to find the absolute right fit. Regardless of whether or not soccer is in the picture, the fit is the most important thing.

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          #34
          I agree with the general point about targeting, and that it can be expensive. it can also take up lots of time trying to go to every camp.

          Maybe there are some boys with the timing stated, but not many. I'd bet over 95% of male college soccer players make their decision in some kind of serious fashion (ie, there is a 2-way commitment, even if not strictly binding) no earlier than spring of junior year.

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            #35
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            I agree with the general point about targeting, and that it can be expensive. it can also take up lots of time trying to go to every camp.

            Maybe there are some boys with the timing stated, but not many. I'd bet over 95% of male college soccer players make their decision in some kind of serious fashion (ie, there is a 2-way commitment, even if not strictly binding) no earlier than spring of junior year.
            We are in the throngs of this now. My kid wants to look outside the NE so there aren't as many showcase opportunities with his club team and we'll have to do more camps. Some of the problems we're finding are 1) a camp might one or two schools you're interested in and the rest not 2) confirmed coach lists often come very late, sometimes just 2-4 weeks beforehand. Fine if you're local and there's still openings. But if you have to fly this can get costly booking flights or if you want to cancel 3)many of them overlap on key vacation dates. Even in the summer they're all jammed up mid June to late July 4)costs are crazy 5) many are multi-day and include lots of extra stuff like discussion groups, testing, etc. That's great for one time but probably repetitive after one+ camp. I wish there were more one-day event to just be in front of coaches. Would lower the costs too. 6) some coaches will invite their top picks for yet another camp at their school so there's more costs on top of that.

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              #36
              ?? For parents of HS Jr. And Sr. Boys

              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              We are in the throngs of this now. My kid wants to look outside the NE so there aren't as many showcase opportunities with his club team and we'll have to do more camps. Some of the problems we're finding are 1) a camp might one or two schools you're interested in and the rest not 2) confirmed coach lists often come very late, sometimes just 2-4 weeks beforehand. Fine if you're local and there's still openings. But if you have to fly this can get costly booking flights or if you want to cancel 3)many of them overlap on key vacation dates. Even in the summer they're all jammed up mid June to late July 4)costs are crazy 5) many are multi-day and include lots of extra stuff like discussion groups, testing, etc. That's great for one time but probably repetitive after one+ camp. I wish there were more one-day event to just be in front of coaches. Would lower the costs too. 6) some coaches will invite their top picks for yet another camp at their school so there's more costs on top of that.
              For the one day camp, what are you actually paying for? I mean, I understand what you are there for. But it appears to be a money maker for the coach. Coach probably doesn't pay for use of the field. Maybe a janitor needs to be paid or a trainer needs to be there. I get email solicitations all summer long for this stuff, probably due to my got soccer account and having a HS-aged player, so it seems like a scam. Am I way off-base here?
              And then after you play for year or two, you get cut or quit and get stuck paying the full boat for the next 2-3 years. Maybe an ex-college coach can provide the business model of the profitability of college sports.

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                #37
                For boys: 1. Except for a couple/few kids per year around here, there is no significant money involved. So unless you're being chased (in which case you wouldn't be worried about these camps), there is no athletic scholarship money. That makes it easier- take that part out of the equation. 2. Then, from my experience, most people over-estimate where (how high a level) their kid can play. Look at the lists in the "commitment" threads in here- is your kid as good as the kids listed? if you don't know any of the kids, that may say something. Presumably there's someone from your kid's club or high school who you know who you can benchmark against. Not definitive (some HS stars don't pan out in college, and vice versa), but it's a start.

                Comment


                  #38
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  For boys: 1. Except for a couple/few kids per year around here, there is no significant money involved. So unless you're being chased (in which case you wouldn't be worried about these camps), there is no athletic scholarship money. That makes it easier- take that part out of the equation. 2. Then, from my experience, most people over-estimate where (how high a level) their kid can play. Look at the lists in the "commitment" threads in here- is your kid as good as the kids listed? if you don't know any of the kids, that may say something. Presumably there's someone from your kid's club or high school who you know who you can benchmark against. Not definitive (some HS stars don't pan out in college, and vice versa), but it's a start.
                  l read this a lot "there is no athletic scholarship money available" or something to that effect. What type of money is actually offered for most boys who do get offers?

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    l read this a lot "there is no athletic scholarship money available" or something to that effect. What type of money is actually offered for most boys who do get offers?
                    $8$-$12k is the average. Even little bit helps but unless you have a stud you'll never see a full ride. Even 50% is very rare. A good student often can get more with academic $ and possibly financial aid if the family qualifies. Something all boy parents need to keep in mind

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                      #40
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      For the one day camp, what are you actually paying for? I mean, I understand what you are there for. But it appears to be a money maker for the coach. Coach probably doesn't pay for use of the field. Maybe a janitor needs to be paid or a trainer needs to be there. I get email solicitations all summer long for this stuff, probably due to my got soccer account and having a HS-aged player, so it seems like a scam. Am I way off-base here?
                      And then after you play for year or two, you get cut or quit and get stuck paying the full boat for the next 2-3 years. Maybe an ex-college coach can provide the business model of the profitability of college sports.
                      That posters example is more if you want to get exposure outside the area. If you're at a good club that attends good showcase tourneys you shouldn't need to do much on the id camp front. Some coaches will run small invite only camps for a select group of players he is interested in. If you are interested in the school/program you must attend that because you spend some time on campus, get to know the coach better, other players etc.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        For boys: 1. Except for a couple/few kids per year around here, there is no significant money involved. So unless you're being chased (in which case you wouldn't be worried about these camps), there is no athletic scholarship money. That makes it easier- take that part out of the equation. 2. Then, from my experience, most people over-estimate where (how high a level) their kid can play. Look at the lists in the "commitment" threads in here- is your kid as good as the kids listed? if you don't know any of the kids, that may say something. Presumably there's someone from your kid's club or high school who you know who you can benchmark against. Not definitive (some HS stars don't pan out in college, and vice versa), but it's a start.
                        True but don't forget there are many players out there with no formal commitment announcements etc and a great many schools out there looking for solid players. Granted academically they might not be everyone's top choice but not everyone can play soccer at Stanford.

                        I do agree parents and players often aren't realistic and should have open discussions with present coaches about what level if any is appropriate to target.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          l read this a lot "there is no athletic scholarship money available" or something to that effect. What type of money is actually offered for most boys who do get offers?
                          I know of one foreign kid who got full ride to BU. Offered in his Junior year and he accepted. Leading goal scorer in the ISL this year and selected All American. But that is not typical at all.

                          Some other facts for you. A Patriot league school like Bucknell has 0 athletic money for boys soccer. UMASS Amherst has 2 to split with all the team (and they have a poor program). Some D2 schools have 1 or 2. That is pretty typical for boys soccer it seems. BU has no football so that is probably why they have more athletic money.

                          The Patriot League schools for the most part are solid academic schools (Colgate, Bucknell, BU, etc) and will provide close to 100% need based aid. I found their aid to be a bit less than similar D3 schools (I have kids at top 25 academic LAC schools so I have a reference point). They do add a bit for athletics..my son was offered $5k extra in grant money than he would get for just need based. In the end he decided against it. One option is a military school like Navy.

                          There are so many factors to consider in choosing a school. Don't think the athletic funds is a factor for men's soccer in 95% of the cases. My son had offers to play at several D1 schools (admissions support, a little boost in grant aid, etc) but chose D3 with very strong soccer program but equally important it is a good fit for him in other ways.

                          Good luck. FYI the school he chose was based on a 2 day ID camp and visit in the fall of his senior year. If he did not attend the camp this school would have never seen him. I think the 1 or 2 day camps are best because you can target the school better and coach knows you are interested in them. But a word of warning..some coaches running these have told me for both son and daughter that they were really only interested in one or two kids attending (my kids were invited) the camp so in some cases they already know who they want to watch and it is difficult to make an impression if they have not seen you play at all previously.

                          I would advise to do an overnight visit to get a feel for the culture of both the team and school. Also one thing I was surprised at is that even some D3 schools paid for (or were willing to pay for) flights to visit their schools - after they decided they had an interest of course. I did not think D3 would do that but they did.

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            That posters example is more if you want to get exposure outside the area. If you're at a good club that attends good showcase tourneys you shouldn't need to do much on the id camp front. Some coaches will run small invite only camps for a select group of players he is interested in. If you are interested in the school/program you must attend that because you spend some time on campus, get to know the coach better, other players etc.
                            This is nothing but the typical club Kool-Aid coming back at you. The whole showcase route is basically a fool's errand because your kid has to be able to stand out in a very very crowded space in order for it to work at all. Truthfully when your kid is that good they don't need the showcases because they get approached before most of them even happen. They go to a showcase to close the deal, not open one.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              This is nothing but the typical club Kool-Aid coming back at you. The whole showcase route is basically a fool's errand because your kid has to be able to stand out in a very very crowded space in order for it to work at all. Truthfully when your kid is that good they don't need the showcases because they get approached before most of them even happen. They go to a showcase to close the deal, not open one.
                              Nice catch, BTDT. Good to see you are still so involved.

                              Comment

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