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    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    No, they aren't. The impact players on your daughter's team might not even play at a top 10 program, and the bench players on your daughter's team might not start on a decent D2 or D3 program. It comes down to how well you (and your club coaches and anyone else helping to find the right fit) assess your player's fit to the roster at a potential school. For maximum $'s and impact (i.e., your kid is way too important to be strung along by a slimy coach), you have to find a program that is hungry for players of her skill and talent. You can't be stretching to join a program where she's just another player until she manages to prove herself.

    Congrats to her for being tough & resilient and earning her playing time, but you got played by the coach because your daughter was not important enough to him not to risk screwing around with the $. The lesson here: if getting $'s is important, find a program where your product is in the highest possible demand.
    Bingo.

    Comment


      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      It sounded like an awful situation and I totally related so I get it and wasn't really criticizing you. Your kid is at an age where they are responsible for their own decisions so I get that your impact on the situation is probably limited to "advice." We do however have much more life experience than our kids do at that age so I think a big part of how we can help them during the college years is by sharing it with them. What I did in a similar situation was help my kid separate the emotion from the facts in order to clarify the situation and then calmly discuss the pros and cons of possible reactions so she could make up her own mind about what she wanted to do about it. The reason I responded the way I did is I think a lot of people on this site fantasize about being a D1 athlete and gloss over just how much it of can really suck if our kids end up in the wrong situation. We tend to spend way more time talking about esoteric things like the schools academic rankings rather than day in and day out grind that we put our kids into. When that situation ends up wrong it can really screw up a kid. You apparently know as well as I do that every kid knows what every other kid on the team is getting for scholarship money and that they actually keep score like the pros do so when something is out of whack like it seems in your kid's case, it can be demoralizing. I think you pretty much intimated that in your first post and that is what struck me. Personally, I know kids that have walked-on. Most don't ever get to even see the field and getting any money is always an uphill climb because the money is generally committed for 6-8 years by the time they step on campus. Unfortunately a lot of coaches will never really adjust their budgets to accommodate a kid like yours because it is like a pro being on a team friendly contract. They're getting a deal. and it's business. I think too many people confuse college soccer with high school and club and cede too much power to the college coaches as a result. If someone has a kid that is not getting paid properly or the program is not going to play them then I think we really need to evaluate the situation and decide whether or not it works. I get that each family's decision is not always all about soccer but there has to be a balance that is palatable to the kids who are grinding it out. It seems as though your kid did find that balance, which is great, but not everyone is so fortunate. That's why the transfer rates are so high.
      Did you "help" your kid "decide" to go to MCLA by demanding that if she chose to continue playing soccer you wouldn't be giving her a dime? Did you also prevent her access to her own trust fund from your Dad?

      Comment


        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        No, they aren't. The impact players on your daughter's team might not even play at a top 10 program, and the bench players on your daughter's team might not start on a decent D2 or D3 program. It comes down to how well you (and your club coaches and anyone else helping to find the right fit) assess your player's fit to the roster at a potential school. For maximum $'s and impact (i.e., your kid is way too important to be strung along by a slimy coach), you have to find a program that is hungry for players of her skill and talent. You can't be stretching to join a program where she's just another player until she manages to prove herself.

        Congrats to her for being tough & resilient and earning her playing time, but you got played by the coach because your daughter was not important enough to him not to risk screwing around with the $. The lesson here: if getting $'s is important, find a program where your product is in the highest possible demand.
        Most everyone wants to get paid properly and a big chunk of doing that is properly assessing what the actual job is. Way too many here don't assess just how much of their kid's soul they are selling and then sell them short. As an athlete it really sucks to be sitting on the bench if you are the least bit competitive. Especially when you are doing the day in and day out work just like everyone else on the team and not getting even the slightest chance to play. The bottom line really is that fit goes way deeper than just the academics.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          How about this scenario. Your kid commits late to a college with D1 W soccer.
          Definitely on low end of scholarship award. Starts every game and is impact player. Does scholarship money ever get increased?
          Yes, former MVP of my D's team was a very late commit (played on a crap club and verbally committed to a crappy D2 in the middle of nowhere, before being referred). Played first year with no money, made her mark and got a full boat for last 2 years.

          Comment


            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            In my d"s team, those same train wrecks, played.
            Your d's team has terrible coaches then.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              Most everyone wants to get paid properly and a big chunk of doing that is properly assessing what the actual job is. Way too many here don't assess just how much of their kid's soul they are selling and then sell them short. As an athlete it really sucks to be sitting on the bench if you are the least bit competitive. Especially when you are doing the day in and day out work just like everyone else on the team and not getting even the slightest chance to play. The bottom line really is that fit goes way deeper than just the academics.
              You're correct this time, BTNT....fit is much more than academics. Many factors like size, preference for urban versus rural, close to home versus some preferring to get further away from home, studying abroad or not....AND athletics. Many choose D3 because of the fit relative to academics AND athletics in addition to multiple other factors.

              Comment


                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                You think club play instilled the ability to recognize a bad situation or a situation of being undervalued and value being supressed? That is just good instincts.
                What you call instinct was likely honed by the dog-eat-dog experience of club soccer. Slimeball coaches who sell a dream to get you to sign and then don’t deliver because their job and pay depends on families signing up to pay thousands to train with anyone who could afford it, travel to tournaments out of state when the team isn’t even top 10 in the state, and compete in meh leagues. Humans are by nature trusting... it took experience to change that.

                Congratz for getting through it to college play, only 2% of high school athletes manage to make it to D1.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  Wow, BTNT, incredibly insightful and fresh advice...as though 99% of the soccer population doesn't know any of that. But what else should we expect form someone who makes an hourly wage under $20.
                  I A-M N-O-T H-I-M
                  You really are annoying, and useless. Please get help

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    Did you "help" your kid "decide" to go to MCLA by demanding that if she chose to continue playing soccer you wouldn't be giving her a dime? Did you also prevent her access to her own trust fund from your Dad?
                    My kid was the one who chose to go to MCLA. We looked at many options, and truth be told, most were at the D2 level. Her first choice was actually St Rose which should be an indication to you that she really wasn't interested in a high brow school and that we were trying to target correctly. The coach at St Rose pretty much jerked her around though so she moved on to other choices and eventually landed at Fairleigh Dickinson which unfortunately ended up to be somewhat of a bad fit for her. It was too big, too far way and it became clear she was never going to play there. The academics fit for her though which should say something to my lunatic stalker what the actually choices that kid had. When she wanted to transfer we actually were trying to steer her up in school to UMass Lowell because it had the major she was interested in at the time. We wanted her to give up soccer and focus on academics which she didn't have a high degree of interest in at that point. She was primarily interested in only playing soccer and still wanted to play so truth be told it was a struggle within the family. She chose MCLA because it had a small campus which she felt comfortable in, had the same academic track she was interested in, had a reciprocal agreement with another school for admission into a corresponding grad program and she knew and respected the soccer coach there so all in all we felt is was a good compromise. The kid went there, played soccer and did well at it, graduated with honors and generally was happy. It ended up to be a pretty good fit for that particular kid. I'm sorry that this lunatic can't appreciate that fact and has felt the need to pass judgement all of these years. For those that don't know we are talking about a 28 year old person who has been out of college for going on 6 years at this point. She's doing fine in life and actually bought her first investment property earlier in the year. This lunatic crapping all over her because he has some weird grudge with me gets a bit old.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      My kid was the one who chose to go to MCLA. We looked at many options, and truth be told, most were at the D2 level. Her first choice was actually St Rose which should be an indication to you that she really wasn't interested in a high brow school and that we were trying to target correctly. The coach at St Rose pretty much jerked her around though so she moved on to other choices and eventually landed at Fairleigh Dickinson which unfortunately ended up to be somewhat of a bad fit for her. It was too big, too far way and it became clear she was never going to play there. The academics fit for her though which should say something to my lunatic stalker what the actually choices that kid had. When she wanted to transfer we actually were trying to steer her up in school to UMass Lowell because it had the major she was interested in at the time. We wanted her to give up soccer and focus on academics which she didn't have a high degree of interest in at that point. She was primarily interested in only playing soccer and still wanted to play so truth be told it was a struggle within the family. She chose MCLA because it had a small campus which she felt comfortable in, had the same academic track she was interested in, had a reciprocal agreement with another school for admission into a corresponding grad program and she knew and respected the soccer coach there so all in all we felt is was a good compromise. The kid went there, played soccer and did well at it, graduated with honors and generally was happy. It ended up to be a pretty good fit for that particular kid. I'm sorry that this lunatic can't appreciate that fact and has felt the need to pass judgement all of these years. For those that don't know we are talking about a 28 year old person who has been out of college for going on 6 years at this point. She's doing fine in life and actually bought her first investment property earlier in the year. This lunatic crapping all over her because he has some weird grudge with me gets a bit old.
                      "We wanted her to give up soccer and focus on academics...."

                      Who always chastises everyone else with the "if it's all about the academics why even bother"?

                      "Truth be told it was a struggle within the family..."

                      So, in brief, you did NOT want her to play soccer at a level consistent with her abilities. You did NOT want to help pay for Wheaton or SLU or William Smith.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        I’m not this poster - just so you know Plebe - but this is important advice as long as we recognize the IF. If money is less important than Academics, School Experience, whatever then by all means make your decision on those factors, but if you are looking for money you have to dip down to be valued. Unless of course player really is a true tier talent, then you have choices
                        This is really the foundation of so much of the back and forth on this site about academics. At the D3 level soccer is supposed to be a secondary focus and it is completely appropriate to weigh things like academics and school experience because you are a buyer and that is what you are purchasing. At the D1 level it is the inverse. Its a business situation. You are a seller and what you are selling is essentially your kid's labor. Their pay level, work conditions and their opportunity for success are really the primary things you need to weigh. When you apply a D3 level decision matrix to a D1 situation like so many here propose you do, you run the risk of under estimating the entire situation and coming away with a disastrous decision.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          This is really the foundation of so much of the back and forth on this site about academics. At the D3 level soccer is supposed to be a secondary focus and it is completely appropriate to weigh things like academics and school experience because you are a buyer and that is what you are purchasing. At the D1 level it is the inverse. Its a business situation. You are a seller and what you are selling is essentially your kid's labor. Their pay level, work conditions and their opportunity for success are really the primary things you need to weigh. When you apply a D3 level decision matrix to a D1 situation like so many here propose you do, you run the risk of under estimating the entire situation and coming away with a disastrous decision.
                          Where are all those horrific tragedies? Can you admit that most end up pretty darn happy?

                          And please he honest, would your Duke kid still have wanted to play at Duke if there was no money but she knew she would play? Does SHE play because of the money? OR, is that just the you LET her play?

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            You're correct this time, BTNT....fit is much more than academics. Many factors like size, preference for urban versus rural, close to home versus some preferring to get further away from home, studying abroad or not....AND athletics. Many choose D3 because of the fit relative to academics AND athletics in addition to multiple other factors.
                            Well put but of course way too factual and logical for him.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              Where are all those horrific tragedies? Can you admit that most end up pretty darn happy?

                              And please he honest, would your Duke kid still have wanted to play at Duke if there was no money but she knew she would play? Does SHE play because of the money? OR, is that just the you LET her play?
                              You are delusional if you think everyone ends up "pretty darn happy". Content, maybe, but in such a usury environment with so many variable involved its pretty hard to attain happiness. Are the kids who over reached and didn't have the impact they dreamed of happy? Are the kids on the cellar dwelling teams who realize their team will never be competitive happy? Are the kids that just found out their coach is leaving and are now contemplating transferring because of it happy? Are the kids who got jerked around by their coaches and lied to happy? Are the kids that sustained injuries during the season and now are facing surgery and months of rehab happy? All of these kids might end up staying put because in the end they figure that they are content enough with their situation but to suggest that everyone is pretty darn happy is pretty darn Pollyannaish thinking.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                                You are delusional if you think everyone ends up "pretty darn happy". Content, maybe, but in such a usury environment with so many variable involved its pretty hard to attain happiness. Are the kids who over reached and didn't have the impact they dreamed of happy? Are the kids on the cellar dwelling teams who realize their team will never be competitive happy? Are the kids that just found out their coach is leaving and are now contemplating transferring because of it happy? Are the kids who got jerked around by their coaches and lied to happy? Are the kids that sustained injuries during the season and now are facing surgery and months of rehab happy? All of these kids might end up staying put because in the end they figure that they are content enough with their situation but to suggest that everyone is pretty darn happy is pretty darn Pollyannaish thinking.
                                Sounds like you should have gone D3.

                                And you didn't answer the question....does your kid play at Duke because she is "paid" or would she have wanted to play regardless?

                                Comment

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