Refs out there: When is a shoulder a foul?

[Unregistered]

I will leave everybody with one last thought. How many times has the referee change his or her mind after yelling at them? Is it really worth it?

Saw it happen. ONCE!

[Unregistered]

Saw it happen. ONCE!

SO ..... THERE IS A CHANCE!!! Keep it up fellas.

[Unregistered]

SO ..... THERE IS A CHANCE!!! Keep it up fellas.

Ha. It was somewhat of a joke, but it really did happen. Men's league game, ref makes a call and everyone goes ballistic. Other team just stands there smirking. He looks around, getting heat, and says "shlt with a reaction like that I must've missed it".

Overall, though...please don't yell at the refs. It really doesn't do any good.

[Unregistered]

Shoulder to shoulder contact is not a foul ever in soccer.

Nope.

From the glossary in the laws of the game:
************************************************** *********************
Charge (an opponent)

Physical challenge against an opponent, usually using the shoulder and upper arm (which is kept close to the body)
************************************************** *********************

key word here is "usually" which provides an interesting loophole.

Remember that even though it is with the shoulder, it sill has to be within control and not Careless/Reckless.

I had a call once where a visiting team player was shielding the ball out of play right in front of the home bench. A home player came in and -- shoulder to shoulder -- took a running start and absolutely leveled the guy hockey check style.
I blew the whistle and was reaching for the YC when I heard the home coach yell "oh come on..."

I started to stiffen up and get ready for the inevitable chat with the coach. But he was actually laying into his player..."come on (player's name), that was crazy. why did you do that?!?"

Even some coaches recognize that just because it is with the shoulder, doesn't mean that it is legal...

[Unregistered]

When reckless any things is a foul. When I said should to shoulder was never a foul I meant in the normal play of the game. Two players battling for the ball. If you come running in reckless and take a player out with any part of your body it is a foul.

[Unregistered]

When reckless any things is a foul. When I said should to shoulder was never a foul I meant in the normal play of the game. Two players battling for the ball. If you come running in reckless and take a player out with any part of your body it is a foul.

Yeah but different referees view “reckless” differently . Very subjective.

1) big stronger kid shouldering smaller kid and smaller kid falls over- I’ve seen this called as a foul at least half the time in DA games


2) elbow going up but not making any contact is also called sometimes - which is just ridiculous as elbows go up for balance.

[Unregistered]

Yeah but different referees view “reckless” differently . Very subjective.

1) big stronger kid shouldering smaller kid and smaller kid falls over- I’ve seen this called as a foul at least half the time in DA games


2) elbow going up but not making any contact is also called sometimes - which is just ridiculous as elbows go up for balance.

1) I don't see it very often in DA games since there isn't a huge physical difference. Well, I should say, I don't see it anymore there than anywhere else. Not sure why that was referenced....

[Unregistered]

1) I don't see it very often in DA games since there isn't a huge physical difference. Well, I should say, I don't see it anymore there than anywhere else. Not sure why that was referenced....

It’s referenced because the quality of DA refs are supposed to be high. I see it quite often having two kids in the DA.

[Unregistered]

It’s referenced because the quality of DA refs are supposed to be high. I see it quite often having two kids in the DA.

In my opinion, they are high. But, again, I see it everywhere but most often when you are in an age group where there is a disparate sized players due to puberty. That's not a league thing, that's nature.

[Unregistered]

The length and debate of this thread over ONE type of foul interpretation is why referees have a thankless job. Every sees their own interpretation and why a ref can never win.

[Unregistered]

The length and debate of this thread over ONE type of foul interpretation is why referees have a thankless job. Every sees their own interpretation and why a ref can never win.

No, but figure they tie most of the time (half like the call, half don't...50/50...not bad)!!

[Unregistered]

No, but figure they tie most of the time (half like the call, half don't...50/50...not bad)!!

Still having half the parents on a sideline scream and moan is too much, especially when the referees are youths. No adult wants to take that grief, let alone a teenager just trying to get paid.

[Unregistered]

In my opinion, they are high. But, again, I see it everywhere but most often when you are in an age group where there is a disparate sized players due to puberty. That's not a league thing, that's nature.

you're missing the point. DA refs at that level, should at least know not to penalize a kid just because he's bigger and stronger.

[Unregistered]

you're missing the point. DA refs at that level, should at least know not to penalize a kid just because he's bigger and stronger.

I get your point. They are, in theory, a higher level ref and should call it accordingly. I'm just saying it's happens in every league in the world at every age group.

[Unregistered]

if someone blatantly rams someone with his shoulder not even going for the ball in that instant, is it a foul?

If his elbow goes up like in this video, is it a foul? When one shoulders someone, it's natural sometimes for the elbow to go up. I don't think it's a foul.

http://sendvid.com/vjncjus3


In DA games I see refs call situations like in the above video a foul at least half the time. There is no consistency.

Consistency is paramount but still can be influenced by match temperature. But to answer your question. Shoulder contact is highly judgmental. I look for excessive force, angle and approach to the ball and speed of play. Difference in size of players is not relevant nor is contact that results in a player getting knocked over so long as it is a legal challenge. Arm angle is also important. In any case as it is with many situations judgment is a factor.