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    #31
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    College coaches aren't idiots.
    That is debatable. Lots (most) college so cer is really bad and difficult to watch .... Even teams that are considered top teams.

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      #32
      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      That is debatable. Lots (most) college so cer is really bad and difficult to watch .... Even teams that are considered top teams.

      Right. I mean, I learn everything I need to know about the game right here on TS, where all the experts reside........

      Comment


        #33
        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        That is debatable. Lots (most) college so cer is really bad and difficult to watch .... Even teams that are considered top teams.
        But they have to work with what they have. Overall US soccer is poor quality. Period. Like with youth clubs, college players are spread thin across hundreds of college programs. Coaches can only attract so many players because of either the school itself (academics, location, size etc) the level of play, conference competitiveness. US women's soccer is better than the rest (well, was) but women's soccer as a sport is far less enjoyable to watch than many men's matches.

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          #34
          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          But they have to work with what they have. Overall US soccer is poor quality. Period. Like with youth clubs, college players are spread thin across hundreds of college programs. Coaches can only attract so many players because of either the school itself (academics, location, size etc) the level of play, conference competitiveness. US women's soccer is better than the rest (well, was) but women's soccer as a sport is far less enjoyable to watch than many men's matches.
          Exactly. Blaming your azzhole for the flaming squirts is off-base. Blame the entry, not the exit.

          Clubs are to blame for their poor development. They play to win, are proud of it, send their minions on here to tout their clubs and shame the others. Quality is nowhere in the conversation. So, they turn out crap and colleges have no choice but to accept it.

          Comment


            #35
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            Exactly. Blaming your azzhole for the flaming squirts is off-base. Blame the entry, not the exit.

            Clubs are to blame for their poor development. They play to win, are proud of it, send their minions on here to tout their clubs and shame the others. Quality is nowhere in the conversation. So, they turn out crap and colleges have no choice but to accept it.
            And how much time does a college coach have to "develop" their players, to correct years of bad habits/poor instruction? The fall schedules are as bad as HS with multiple games a week plus tremendous travel. The coaches still have to win to keep their jobs. Not all know what they're doing, but I do think all are trying to do the best they can with what they have.

            Comment


              #36
              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              And how much time does a college coach have to "develop" their players, to correct years of bad habits/poor instruction? The fall schedules are as bad as HS with multiple games a week plus tremendous travel. The coaches still have to win to keep their jobs. Not all know what they're doing, but I do think all are trying to do the best they can with what they have.
              It is my opinion that many do not even try to fix the issues. The issue for me is that many programs with very athletic and technical kids allow them to continue to launch the ball continuously and dribble into the shins of opponents time and time again. So many players do not get the concept of being under pressure or not. They always play as if they have 3 kids on top of them (although I can't figure out for the life of me why so many continue to try to dribble out of madness when they are in the thick of it). So many coaches do not even try to correct these players and those players disrupt the game every play over and over again for the entire team. If the players will not or can't fix these issues then coaches should bench them until they learn. Sorry, 5-6 days of play for 3.5 months in the fall, indoor play over the winter (without coaches), and then a short spring season allows for a lot of time to fix the issues over 4 years. They could also start by trying to recruit smarter players.

              Comment


                #37
                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                It is my opinion that many do not even try to fix the issues. The issue for me is that many programs with very athletic and technical kids allow them to continue to launch the ball continuously and dribble into the shins of opponents time and time again. So many players do not get the concept of being under pressure or not. They always play as if they have 3 kids on top of them (although I can't figure out for the life of me why so many continue to try to dribble out of madness when they are in the thick of it). So many coaches do not even try to correct these players and those players disrupt the game every play over and over again for the entire team. If the players will not or can't fix these issues then coaches should bench them until they learn. Sorry, 5-6 days of play for 3.5 months in the fall, indoor play over the winter (without coaches), and then a short spring season allows for a lot of time to fix the issues over 4 years. They could also start by trying to recruit smarter players.

                Too late. They've got an 18+ year old kid with a lifetime of poor training. They can't fix it in 4 years or less. Win with what they've got most of the time.

                But, to say they don't "fix them" is a fallacy. I had a teammate who was a center back, recruited and showed up and after a deeper look, Coach shook his head and said "I'm going to make you a striker". He red-shirted him and literally tore everything about him down. Basically spent his freshman year re-learning the game and starting all over again.

                Comment


                  #38
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  It is my opinion that many do not even try to fix the issues. The issue for me is that many programs with very athletic and technical kids allow them to continue to launch the ball continuously and dribble into the shins of opponents time and time again. So many players do not get the concept of being under pressure or not. They always play as if they have 3 kids on top of them (although I can't figure out for the life of me why so many continue to try to dribble out of madness when they are in the thick of it). So many coaches do not even try to correct these players and those players disrupt the game every play over and over again for the entire team. If the players will not or can't fix these issues then coaches should bench them until they learn. Sorry, 5-6 days of play for 3.5 months in the fall, indoor play over the winter (without coaches), and then a short spring season allows for a lot of time to fix the issues over 4 years. They could also start by trying to recruit smarter players.
                  Good luck with that. College ball is HS ball on steroids. The coach still has to win to keep his job. Pretty soccer doesn't always win the game in the US. Yes coaches can recruit and smarter coaches can recruit more smart players who play to their style. However, players are also picking a program not just for the program but also the school. The greatest coach can struggle to attract talent if the school holds little appeal to student athletes. It isn't coincidental that the top programs also happen to be great schools.

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    Too late. They've got an 18+ year old kid with a lifetime of poor training. They can't fix it in 4 years or less. Win with what they've got most of the time.

                    But, to say they don't "fix them" is a fallacy. I had a teammate who was a center back, recruited and showed up and after a deeper look, Coach shook his head and said "I'm going to make you a striker". He red-shirted him and literally tore everything about him down. Basically spent his freshman year re-learning the game and starting all over again.
                    That doesn't happen often. More often than not they'll let the kid struggle for PT, cut them and bring in someone else. Like you said there isn't a lot of time to fix things. Coaches look for quick fixes

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      That doesn't happen often. More often than not they'll let the kid struggle for PT, cut them and bring in someone else. Like you said there isn't a lot of time to fix things. Coaches look for quick fixes
                      Absolutely, very rare occurrence. Takes a patience coach and patient player. Coach has to be secure to basically throw the player allotment away. Most of the time, the club that had that player for 10 years screwed them up too badly to fix it now.

                      But, you know, Raise the Game! and all that...

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        Too late. They've got an 18+ year old kid with a lifetime of poor training. They can't fix it in 4 years or less. Win with what they've got most of the time.

                        But, to say they don't "fix them" is a fallacy. I had a teammate who was a center back, recruited and showed up and after a deeper look, Coach shook his head and said "I'm going to make you a striker". He red-shirted him and literally tore everything about him down. Basically spent his freshman year re-learning the game and starting all over again.
                        So, you just presented a story that shows a college coach can have the interest and fix things. You must know how hard it is to take a player that has been defense-oriented for his whole life and try to make them an offensive player .... or the opposite. How did it work out for that player in the long run? I would love to believe that the players are the most important part of the game, but I have seen too many bad coaches ruin rally good teams and many really good coaches help not very good teams improve dramatically and these changes were almost entirely on the shoulders of the coach making teams and players play in certain manners by allowing (or not allowing) different things on the field in practices. Regrettably, players here mostly are not able to put it together on their own and require the puppet-master to pull the right (or wrong) strings for entire games.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          So, you just presented a story that shows a college coach can have the interest and fix things. You must know how hard it is to take a player that has been defense-oriented for his whole life and try to make them an offensive player .... or the opposite. How did it work out for that player in the long run? I would love to believe that the players are the most important part of the game, but I have seen too many bad coaches ruin rally good teams and many really good coaches help not very good teams improve dramatically and these changes were almost entirely on the shoulders of the coach making teams and players play in certain manners by allowing (or not allowing) different things on the field in practices. Regrettably, players here mostly are not able to put it together on their own and require the puppet-master to pull the right (or wrong) strings for entire games.

                          It CAN happen. Player says it was the best thing that ever happened to him. But, as mentioned just earlier, you need a secure coach who can throw a player allotment away and a patient player. A coach can't come in an fix every player; can't redshirt them all.

                          Only rarely can you turn a pile of crap into something edible. Usually, it just stays crap.

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            The crux of the problem with a not playing Ecnl/da is just that: it’s relatively much easier to look like a big frog in a tiny pond than it is to look like a big frog in a giant lake. If a player looks great in NPL, a college coach doesn’t know for sure if the same player would look that good in Ecnl and knows that they likely wouldn’t look that good amongst much better competition. The Ecnl stars on the other hand, look like a unicorn Pegasus if they played in NPL. College coaches know this too.
                            Meh. Play up a year or two in NPL and it becomes more difficult. Yeah, eventually you're the older player and playing up isn't an option, but the reality for girls is that they are attending ID camps their Freshmen year and heavy into recruiting phase sophomore year so that junior year is all about final selection on both sides for most players. Plenty of showcases and ID camps to show their stuff to the coaches while playing up one or two years. By their senior year, they are mostly or already committed.

                            Do you have to play up in DA or ECNL? Nope. Better quality players technically and a deeper bench. However, the reality is as other posters have said, the college game is HS on steroids, so why worry about playing great technical soccer with like-type players in your age group in ECNL and DA when your goal is to be playing kids 2-3 years older in college, who are stronger/faster/smarter and more physical and the play is more direct and less possession focused?

                            Seems to me, the clubs have sold us a bill of goods that if you want to play D1 and get money for college, you have to play ECNL or DA while the college coaches are just piling on at showcases to make their lives easier. Meanwhile, plenty of kids can play at that level not in the highline leagues, but coaches and players have to work a little harder.

                            Bottom line, my frosh who doesn't play ECNL or DA, but played and started HS Varsity and plays up in NEP/NPL shined at the ID camps she attended, especially as compared to the other frosh who mostly seemed to come from DA/ECNL programs. Talent wins in the end, not leagues, not overblown promises from club coaches. You're not guaranteed anything because you spend $20k on travel for a patch...

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              Meh. Play up a year or two in NPL and it becomes more difficult. Yeah, eventually you're the older player and playing up isn't an option, but the reality for girls is that they are attending ID camps their Freshmen year and heavy into recruiting phase sophomore year so that junior year is all about final selection on both sides for most players. Plenty of showcases and ID camps to show their stuff to the coaches while playing up one or two years. By their senior year, they are mostly or already committed.

                              Do you have to play up in DA or ECNL? Nope. Better quality players technically and a deeper bench. However, the reality is as other posters have said, the college game is HS on steroids, so why worry about playing great technical soccer with like-type players in your age group in ECNL and DA when your goal is to be playing kids 2-3 years older in college, who are stronger/faster/smarter and more physical and the play is more direct and less possession focused?

                              Seems to me, the clubs have sold us a bill of goods that if you want to play D1 and get money for college, you have to play ECNL or DA while the college coaches are just piling on at showcases to make their lives easier. Meanwhile, plenty of kids can play at that level not in the highline leagues, but coaches and players have to work a little harder.

                              Bottom line, my frosh who doesn't play ECNL or DA, but played and started HS Varsity and plays up in NEP/NPL shined at the ID camps she attended, especially as compared to the other frosh who mostly seemed to come from DA/ECNL programs. Talent wins in the end, not leagues, not overblown promises from club coaches. You're not guaranteed anything because you spend $20k on travel for a patch...
                              Report back when she gets actual offers and from what types of programs. Also let us know when interested coaches say she should consider moving into a more challenging league. It will happen if she's looking at higher level college programs.

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                                Report back when she gets actual offers and from what types of programs. Also let us know when interested coaches say she should consider moving into a more challenging league. It will happen if she's looking at higher level college programs.
                                Does an NPL player going to FSU qualify?

                                Good players can play and will be found.

                                Comment

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