Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

80% of Boys Academy players are privately trained by academy staff...

Collapse
X
  •  
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    The truth about DA. There are very good players that play for the DA. I would say a few, maybe 1-4 are the very top level players in the Timbers territory. The others are just very good players. That's not a knock, it's just reality. There are a number of reasons that the DA does not have all the best players. In my experience, the reason for this is as follows (and in order):

    #1 It is too big of a time commitment and grind to drive to Beaverton (or Salem). These are kids. They want to lead normal lives. Even the most driven, soccer loving young men, want and need some normalcy in their lives. Many of those kids that grind it out for awhile, often times, they are burned out from the grind of it all and quit. Or get hurt.
    #2 It is too big of a cost get kids to training. While the DA is close to free ($500), the travel commitment just to get kids to training is very costly, not only in gas/car wear and tear, but in parents time. Time is money. When you are spending hours in a car each day, that is money down the drain.
    #3 Kids generally want the high school soccer experience. Some will disagree with me, but I know a number of top talented kids that simply want to play for their school. There's nothing like playing in front of your schoolmates, and playing for your school. This is real.
    #4 Politics. It has been mentioned over and over. I don't think politics is as bad as people are saying. The DA wants to assemble the best team, it's in their best interest to do that. But there is no doubt that kids that have an inside to the program, they often times will have an advantage. I personally think this point is overblown, but nonetheless, it is part of the problem because it turns people off, and thus miss out on talent.
    #5 The goal for most of the top talented soccer players is to play college soccer. People realize that it is 1 in 10,000 that may go pro so college is the goal. College is not the goal for the DA. Great players can get noticed by colleges by playing top club soccer and doing ID camps, maybe dabble in the DA for part of the time. The DA is not necessary at all to play college soccer. It can help, but not necessary.

    Just my own personal thoughts. I've been through it for years, kids participated on and off, and on again. And now off. Many great memories, but also that grind...
    #4 is why my son is not a part of the academy. It may not seem REAL to you because you have either chosen to turn a blind eye to it or you don't really know what is happening. I know several other families that feel the same way and refuse to become part of what the Timbers have become. This leads to them losing out on some of the top players in the area and thus their results suffer and the product they put out is compromised. It is the fault of the Timbers and some of the over zealous parents that allow their ego and checkbooks to drive the bus and not reality. Unfortunately TA is nothing more than an equivalent to the local DA they just travel to play games. The sad part is it could be so much more if they got out of their own way and ran it like most academies. Tryouts should not have been open to everyone (that was honestly just a middle finger and money grab that anyone with a brain could figure out). In a perfect world where clubs and coache actually cared about developing soccer in Oregon it would work like this: all clubs work together to push their top talent out each year to the academy. Timbers personnel watch and scout and give feedback as to their opinions as well and identify kids they feel have merit. Each year would have some turnover for various reasons but the goal would be to push kids from the bottom of the bench at TA back to their local clubs and replace on a yearly basis with those who truly deserve it by play on the field not the amount of money mom and dad have. Also, all kids on the roster would see the field for meaningful minutes and 5-10 are not meaningful as is currently happening. Look at how other Seattle area DA teams are doing it- most subs come in at half and play the entire second half with a few exceptions. I get the feeling TA is scared to do that because they will get completely exposed as to how shady the dealings have been up to this point

    Comment


      It's been a couple of year since I watched the Timbers DA team train and play as moved out of area but at that time it seemed like they chased the creative players away with their style of play. The coaches did not appear to like players interchanging positions nor those who could run at players with the ball. Heavy emphasis on staying in your zone passing the ball. Possession was prevalent but not possession with a purpose.

      Is this still the going on and or did you see the same thing?

      Comment


        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        #4 is why my son is not a part of the academy. It may not seem REAL to you because you have either chosen to turn a blind eye to it or you don't really know what is happening. I know several other families that feel the same way and refuse to become part of what the Timbers have become. This leads to them losing out on some of the top players in the area and thus their results suffer and the product they put out is compromised. It is the fault of the Timbers and some of the over zealous parents that allow their ego and checkbooks to drive the bus and not reality. Unfortunately TA is nothing more than an equivalent to the local DA they just travel to play games. The sad part is it could be so much more if they got out of their own way and ran it like most academies. Tryouts should not have been open to everyone (that was honestly just a middle finger and money grab that anyone with a brain could figure out). In a perfect world where clubs and coache actually cared about developing soccer in Oregon it would work like this: all clubs work together to push their top talent out each year to the academy. Timbers personnel watch and scout and give feedback as to their opinions as well and identify kids they feel have merit. Each year would have some turnover for various reasons but the goal would be to push kids from the bottom of the bench at TA back to their local clubs and replace on a yearly basis with those who truly deserve it by play on the field not the amount of money mom and dad have. Also, all kids on the roster would see the field for meaningful minutes and 5-10 are not meaningful as is currently happening. Look at how other Seattle area DA teams are doing it- most subs come in at half and play the entire second half with a few exceptions. I get the feeling TA is scared to do that because they will get completely exposed as to how shady the dealings have been up to this point
        I was the original poster. I think we are actually saying mostly the same thing. We absolutely saw politics. And it may have been the final straw with one of my boys, granted we were already teetering with quitting for all the other reasons I mentioned. I guess I was just trying to give some benefit of the doubt. I do believe that results matter, or these coaches/staff risk losing their job. From that standpoint, it doesn't make sense to take inferior talent for sake of politics. But I still completely agree that there is politics involved. Who you know, money, those things absolutely give advantages to certain kids, and we saw it too. I just believe that if there is a super talent, they are in regardless. If 2 kids are relatively close in talent, DA politics becomes more prevalent.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          I was the original poster. I think we are actually saying mostly the same thing. We absolutely saw politics. And it may have been the final straw with one of my boys, granted we were already teetering with quitting for all the other reasons I mentioned. I guess I was just trying to give some benefit of the doubt. I do believe that results matter, or these coaches/staff risk losing their job. From that standpoint, it doesn't make sense to take inferior talent for sake of politics. But I still completely agree that there is politics involved. Who you know, money, those things absolutely give advantages to certain kids, and we saw it too. I just believe that if there is a super talent, they are in regardless. If 2 kids are relatively close in talent, DA politics becomes more prevalent.
          it almost seems like people who are used to getting their way are having a problem with the world not being built for them. ( i don't know your situation that's why i said almost.)

          yes, there is politics in everything. office politics keep me from getting to work from home for any amount of time, even though they've had the ability for that since before i started (6 years ago). yes it sucks, but that is one more lesson your player can learn about life.

          sometimes you don't get what you want, for no actual good reason. yes, there will be a reason, "larry sunderland hates me", might be the actual reason, but get over it. go to seattle's academy maybe, or another team. if your player is for sure a player who should be on the team, they'll see it in other pro academies too. if, as you say 2 kids are close politics, or the weather, or how well someone slept the night before will affect who gets to play and who doesn't.

          Comment


            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            it almost seems like people who are used to getting their way are having a problem with the world not being built for them. ( i don't know your situation that's why i said almost.)

            yes, there is politics in everything. office politics keep me from getting to work from home for any amount of time, even though they've had the ability for that since before i started (6 years ago). yes it sucks, but that is one more lesson your player can learn about life.

            sometimes you don't get what you want, for no actual good reason. yes, there will be a reason, "larry sunderland hates me", might be the actual reason, but get over it. go to seattle's academy maybe, or another team. if your player is for sure a player who should be on the team, they'll see it in other pro academies too. if, as you say 2 kids are close politics, or the weather, or how well someone slept the night before will affect who gets to play and who doesn't.
            Actually Larry likes me

            Comment


              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              it almost seems like people who are used to getting their way are having a problem with the world not being built for them. ( i don't know your situation that's why i said almost.)

              yes, there is politics in everything. office politics keep me from getting to work from home for any amount of time, even though they've had the ability for that since before i started (6 years ago). yes it sucks, but that is one more lesson your player can learn about life.

              sometimes you don't get what you want, for no actual good reason. yes, there will be a reason, "larry sunderland hates me", might be the actual reason, but get over it. go to seattle's academy maybe, or another team. if your player is for sure a player who should be on the team, they'll see it in other pro academies too. if, as you say 2 kids are close politics, or the weather, or how well someone slept the night before will affect who gets to play and who doesn't.
              This is black and white thinking ... reality always resides in the grey :)

              If you consider a scale on one side being totally above-board, professional, and making decisions based on what's best for each player's development while the other being shady, unethical, and making decisions based on only one's own self interest the TA is skewed too far towards the latter.

              Of course things are never going to be totally "fair" and you'll never get exactly what you want, however it's not unreasonable to expect an organization like the Portland Timbers to run an Academy generally with some professionalism, creating a positive learning/training environment, and doing what's best for each of the players they bring in.

              Falling significantly short of this standard is why they are losing so many players ... and they will continue to do so until they make some major changes.

              Comment


                They lose players for good reason, they (Oregon Kids) don't belong in an MLS Youth Academy, this isn't rocket science. Sadly they make the mistake of picking (oregon) kids that have no business being part of an MLS Youth Academy. Every year, over and over. It's the timbers house money, why do they care?

                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                This is black and white thinking ... reality always resides in the grey :)

                If you consider a scale on one side being totally above-board, professional, and making decisions based on what's best for each player's development while the other being shady, unethical, and making decisions based on only one's own self interest the TA is skewed too far towards the latter.

                Of course things are never going to be totally "fair" and you'll never get exactly what you want, however it's not unreasonable to expect an organization like the Portland Timbers to run an Academy generally with some professionalism, creating a positive learning/training environment, and doing what's best for each of the players they bring in.

                Falling significantly short of this standard is why they are losing so many players ... and they will continue to do so until they make some major changes.

                Comment


                  Sturgeon's Law

                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  This is black and white thinking ... reality always resides in the grey :)

                  Of course things are never going to be totally "fair" and you'll never get exactly what you want, however it's not unreasonable to expect an organization like the Portland Timbers to run an Academy generally with some professionalism, creating a positive learning/training environment, and doing what's best for each of the players they bring in.
                  i wouldn't call it black and white thinking, i might call it cynical thinking. if you go into work or football thinking the folks in charge know what the hell they are doing, you're going to be shocked at who is running some of the biggest corporations, and heck governments, in the world.

                  if you don't go into it thinking, i need to be so much better than everyone in here, EVERYONE, because i know this coach is going to eff it up... then, as the poster right above me said, you don't belong in the academy.

                  "They lose players for good reason, they (Oregon Kids) don't belong in an MLS Youth Academy, this isn't rocket science. Sadly they make the mistake of picking (oregon) kids that have no business being part of an MLS Youth Academy. Every year, over and over. It's the timbers house money, why do they care?"

                  i might also call it all black thinking, instead of black and white thinking.

                  90% of everything sucks, of that remaining ten percent only 90% of that barely doesn't suck, of that one percent left only 90% is ok, ad infinitum.

                  happy friday eve, y'all.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    They lose players for good reason, they (Oregon Kids) don't belong in an MLS Youth Academy, this isn't rocket science. Sadly they make the mistake of picking (oregon) kids that have no business being part of an MLS Youth Academy. Every year, over and over. It's the timbers house money, why do they care?
                    No Oregon soccer player deserves to be in an MLS Youth Academy?

                    I don't even know what to call this ... Stateism? (I.e. having a prejudice against someone based on the state the live in).

                    Regardless it's terrible logic and has no place in any kind of reasonable discussion!

                    But alas, this forum is full of people using logical fallacies to try and prove a point. Ugh!

                    Sometimes I wonder why I even bother ...

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      If you consider a scale on one side being totally above-board, professional, and making decisions based on what's best for each player's development while the other being shady, unethical, and making decisions based on only one's own self interest the TA is skewed too far towards the latter.
                      also, the academy is not setup to do what's best for each player. it is setup only for the TA's self interest. and academies only happened because they were mandated.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        No Oregon soccer player deserves to be in an MLS Youth Academy?

                        I don't even know what to call this ... Stateism? (I.e. having a prejudice against someone based on the state the live in).

                        Regardless it's terrible logic and has no place in any kind of reasonable discussion!

                        But alas, this forum is full of people using logical fallacies to try and prove a point. Ugh!

                        Sometimes I wonder why I even bother ...
                        no, the players that they lose don't belong. i'm not the one who wrote that, but i could read that's what they meant. because it's what they wrote.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          i wouldn't call it black and white thinking, i might call it cynical thinking. if you go into work or football thinking the folks in charge know what the hell they are doing, you're going to be shocked at who is running some of the biggest corporations, and heck governments, in the world.

                          if you don't go into it thinking, i need to be so much better than everyone in here, EVERYONE, because i know this coach is going to eff it up... then, as the poster right above me said, you don't belong in the academy.

                          "They lose players for good reason, they (Oregon Kids) don't belong in an MLS Youth Academy, this isn't rocket science. Sadly they make the mistake of picking (oregon) kids that have no business being part of an MLS Youth Academy. Every year, over and over. It's the timbers house money, why do they care?"

                          i might also call it all black thinking, instead of black and white thinking.

                          90% of everything sucks, of that remaining ten percent only 90% of that barely doesn't suck, of that one percent left only 90% is ok, ad infinitum.

                          happy friday eve, y'all.
                          Start early on the drinking today?

                          It's Thursday ...

                          You are very cynical indeed. I, on the other hand, am an optimist by nature and tend to try and hold my fellow human beings (and the organizations they are involved in) to a higher standard. Starting, of course, with myself.

                          I guess we just are who we are ... eh?

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            Start early on the drinking today?

                            It's Thursday ...

                            You are very cynical indeed. I, on the other hand, am an optimist by nature and tend to try and hold my fellow human beings (and the organizations they are involved in) to a higher standard. Starting, of course, with myself.

                            I guess we just are who we are ... eh?
                            typically the day before a day is called the "eve" of that day. (yes, it should probably only be the evening before the day, but that's not how the public has chosen to use the term.) christmas eve is the day before christmas, new year's eve is the day before new year's, etc.

                            expecting everything to be a shambles and so expecting to have to be the best is holding a higher standard; one that is built on more than optimism. keep being optimistic that your player is good enough, hope they make it to league MVP.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              They lose players for good reason, they (Oregon Kids) don't belong in an MLS Youth Academy, this isn't rocket science. Sadly they make the mistake of picking (oregon) kids that have no business being part of an MLS Youth Academy. Every year, over and over. It's the timbers house money, why do they care?
                              Exactly the problem, they should care and look to develop local talent- the 05 age group has a big enough group of talent that they could compete on a national level if politics were left out of it...

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                                Exactly the problem, they should care and look to develop local talent- the 05 age group has a big enough group of talent that they could compete on a national level if politics were left out of it...
                                politics cannot and will not be left out of it, it's human nature. that's the point. rise above it. i believe republicans call it "bootstrapping", marginalized folks call it "living".

                                Comment

                                Previously entered content was automatically saved. Restore or Discard.
                                Auto-Saved
                                x
                                Insert: Thumbnail Small Medium Large Fullsize Remove  
                                x
                                Working...
                                X