Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Can someone explain the league alphabet soup?

Collapse
X
  •  
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    Your response was the one valid response. I was critical of the others.
    So the answers advising the OP to not worry about leagues, and focus on club and team fit were nihilistic brat responses? I've got several kids playing club, and I've always trusted that the club and coach would place the team in the appropriate league. It's worked very well for us. How is that nihilistic?

    Comment


      #17
      There are two sanctioning bodies in youth soccer USYS and USCS.

      US Youth Soccer (USYS) has a clear hierarchy in their leagues:

      National League
      Regional Premier Leagues (in our case R1P)
      Sub Regional Premier (in our case NERP)

      below this are state and regional USYS leagues that are relatively autonomous and manage their own promotion and relegation for us that would be MAPLE and NEP.

      USYS also runs the National Championship Series (aka State Cup), these are essential season long tournaments.

      In order to play in State Cup you must play in one of the qualifying leagues (eg the 5 listed above)

      State Cup winners move on to Regionals and face other Region 1 state winners (eg ME, NH, NY, RI, NJ, VA, MD, VT). Winners move on to Nationals.

      A teams performance in the National Championship Series is used to place teams in the various USYS leagues. Teams can also qualify by their previous performance in the USYS leagues.

      USYS also runs an identification program called ODP which is one of the pipelines to the various age group National Teams.


      US Club Soccer (USCS) also sanctions various leagues.

      The top leagues they sanction are various NPLs and the ECNL.

      The ECNL was formed several years ago when many of the best clubs in the country decided that USYS wasn't being responsive to their needs. The top teams at these clubs (mostly) left USYS competitions (although some clubs do still participate in some USYS leagues/events).

      The clubs that left were truly some (not all) of the countries best clubs (representing the majority of the Regional and National Champions from the previous year across all age groups.

      ECNL is divided into 7 regional leagues. Teams will typically play about 16 regional games and 12 showcase games (against other regions ECNL teams). For many clubs, these showcase games take the place of the tournaments that teams typically used to fill out the rest of their schedules.

      The defection of these clubs weakened many of the USYS leagues and this, combined with the factors that initially lead to the ECNL clubs leaving caused many of the remaining USYS clubs to form regional NPLs.

      The various NPLs are autonomous leagues that all send teams to a National Finals each year. The NPLs in our area are the New England Premier League, the Northeast NPL and NY Club Soccer League.

      USCS has not declared a hierarchy for their leagues and his is where most of the long running vitriol on TS comes from. The ECNL teams argue that they were the best clubs and they still are the best clubs. The NPL clubs will argue that the lack of a relegation program (coupled with the natural ebb and flow of clubs) and the expansion of ECNL to ensure geographic diversity obliterates the ECNLs claim on superiority.

      USCS also runs identification programs including id2 and PDPs.

      USCS has also run a National Championship series that has never generated much interest. Recently, they have started running State Cups, in direct competition with USYS. NYs has been very successful and rumor has it they will be running something similar in MA next year.

      Comment


        #18
        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        So the answers advising the OP to not worry about leagues, and focus on club and team fit were nihilistic brat responses? I've got several kids playing club, and I've always trusted that the club and coach would place the team in the appropriate league. It's worked very well for us. How is that nihilistic?
        No, the response about being naive and "are you kidding" etc.

        Comment


          #19
          The term "alphabet soup" has been code in some of the most vicious discussions on TS. Seems remarkable that a newbie would start a new thread to ask about this and use that exact terminology. Call me a cynic.

          Comment


            #20
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            There are two sanctioning bodies in youth soccer USYS and USCS.

            US Youth Soccer (USYS) has a clear hierarchy in their leagues:

            National League
            Regional Premier Leagues (in our case R1P)
            Sub Regional Premier (in our case NERP)

            below this are state and regional USYS leagues that are relatively autonomous and manage their own promotion and relegation for us that would be MAPLE and NEP.

            USYS also runs the National Championship Series (aka State Cup), these are essential season long tournaments.

            In order to play in State Cup you must play in one of the qualifying leagues (eg the 5 listed above)

            State Cup winners move on to Regionals and face other Region 1 state winners (eg ME, NH, NY, RI, NJ, VA, MD, VT). Winners move on to Nationals.

            A teams performance in the National Championship Series is used to place teams in the various USYS leagues. Teams can also qualify by their previous performance in the USYS leagues.

            USYS also runs an identification program called ODP which is one of the pipelines to the various age group National Teams.


            US Club Soccer (USCS) also sanctions various leagues.

            The top leagues they sanction are various NPLs and the ECNL.

            The ECNL was formed several years ago when many of the best clubs in the country decided that USYS wasn't being responsive to their needs. The top teams at these clubs (mostly) left USYS competitions (although some clubs do still participate in some USYS leagues/events).

            The clubs that left were truly some (not all) of the countries best clubs (representing the majority of the Regional and National Champions from the previous year across all age groups.

            ECNL is divided into 7 regional leagues. Teams will typically play about 16 regional games and 12 showcase games (against other regions ECNL teams). For many clubs, these showcase games take the place of the tournaments that teams typically used to fill out the rest of their schedules.

            The defection of these clubs weakened many of the USYS leagues and this, combined with the factors that initially lead to the ECNL clubs leaving caused many of the remaining USYS clubs to form regional NPLs.

            The various NPLs are autonomous leagues that all send teams to a National Finals each year. The NPLs in our area are the New England Premier League, the Northeast NPL and NY Club Soccer League.

            USCS has not declared a hierarchy for their leagues and his is where most of the long running vitriol on TS comes from. The ECNL teams argue that they were the best clubs and they still are the best clubs. The NPL clubs will argue that the lack of a relegation program (coupled with the natural ebb and flow of clubs) and the expansion of ECNL to ensure geographic diversity obliterates the ECNLs claim on superiority.

            USCS also runs identification programs including id2 and PDPs.

            USCS has also run a National Championship series that has never generated much interest. Recently, they have started running State Cups, in direct competition with USYS. NYs has been very successful and rumor has it they will be running something similar in MA next year.
            Some would argue that USCS actually pulled the rug out from the ECNL clubs. They sanctioned the ECNL to pull the monster clubs in the country away from USYS and then once those clubs switched over they created the NPL and are putting all of their efforts into making it their top league.

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              There are two sanctioning bodies in youth soccer USYS and USCS.

              US Youth Soccer (USYS) has a clear hierarchy in their leagues:

              National League
              Regional Premier Leagues (in our case R1P)
              Sub Regional Premier (in our case NERP)

              below this are state and regional USYS leagues that are relatively autonomous and manage their own promotion and relegation for us that would be MAPLE and NEP.

              USYS also runs the National Championship Series (aka State Cup), these are essential season long tournaments.

              In order to play in State Cup you must play in one of the qualifying leagues (eg the 5 listed above)

              State Cup winners move on to Regionals and face other Region 1 state winners (eg ME, NH, NY, RI, NJ, VA, MD, VT). Winners move on to Nationals.

              A teams performance in the National Championship Series is used to place teams in the various USYS leagues. Teams can also qualify by their previous performance in the USYS leagues.

              USYS also runs an identification program called ODP which is one of the pipelines to the various age group National Teams.


              US Club Soccer (USCS) also sanctions various leagues.

              The top leagues they sanction are various NPLs and the ECNL.

              The ECNL was formed several years ago when many of the best clubs in the country decided that USYS wasn't being responsive to their needs. The top teams at these clubs (mostly) left USYS competitions (although some clubs do still participate in some USYS leagues/events).

              The clubs that left were truly some (not all) of the countries best clubs (representing the majority of the Regional and National Champions from the previous year across all age groups.

              ECNL is divided into 7 regional leagues. Teams will typically play about 16 regional games and 12 showcase games (against other regions ECNL teams). For many clubs, these showcase games take the place of the tournaments that teams typically used to fill out the rest of their schedules.

              The defection of these clubs weakened many of the USYS leagues and this, combined with the factors that initially lead to the ECNL clubs leaving caused many of the remaining USYS clubs to form regional NPLs.

              The various NPLs are autonomous leagues that all send teams to a National Finals each year. The NPLs in our area are the New England Premier League, the Northeast NPL and NY Club Soccer League.

              USCS has not declared a hierarchy for their leagues and his is where most of the long running vitriol on TS comes from. The ECNL teams argue that they were the best clubs and they still are the best clubs. The NPL clubs will argue that the lack of a relegation program (coupled with the natural ebb and flow of clubs) and the expansion of ECNL to ensure geographic diversity obliterates the ECNLs claim on superiority.

              USCS also runs identification programs including id2 and PDPs.

              USCS has also run a National Championship series that has never generated much interest. Recently, they have started running State Cups, in direct competition with USYS. NYs has been very successful and rumor has it they will be running something similar in MA next year.

              Good breakdown! Just to clarify for the OP, this is the landscape for the girls side of things. On the Boys side its a little different at the top as it includes DAP which is considered the top program. But this is a good detailed and objective run-down of the alphabet soup. I wish I had the guts to ask the question when I first found TS, as it took me a few months to figure it all out on my own, especially since I arrived here a few years ago when things were really just starting to change and take off with USCS. So if you are fairly new to the club soccer world and TS, this is very helpful IMO.

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                The term "alphabet soup" has been code in some of the most vicious discussions on TS. Seems remarkable that a newbie would start a new thread to ask about this and use that exact terminology. Call me a cynic.
                Be a cynic all you want, but there is always a newbie who can benefit from the landscape breakdown every now and then. Hurts no one, so relax.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  Some would argue that USCS actually pulled the rug out from the ECNL clubs. They sanctioned the ECNL to pull the monster clubs in the country away from USYS and then once those clubs switched over they created the NPL and are putting all of their efforts into making it their top league.
                  And many would argue there is absolutely no evidence for the last part of your statement.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    OP,

                    I would take post #11 as a general hierarchy and add in post #17 info/details and note the footnote of #21.

                    If you are looking into U14 then High School and ISL come into play but that might muddy the waters for your answer.

                    Lastly -- the club discussion and how they relate to each league becomes very important and in no ways meant to "dictate" your direction.

                    Good luck sorting it out. Like the other posters noted, this takes some time to sort out and just when you do, it can change on you.

                    -- Pathfinder

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      And many would argue there is absolutely no evidence for the last part of your statement.
                      You don't need a billboard to read what is going on. USCS is in the business of building membership. Logic says that a closed league will never be USCS's top most offering because it doesn't give them any way to recruit new members unless they tear down the walls and allow those new clubs to aspire to it. USCS is building their whole competitive platform around the NPL. USCS clearly wants the NPL to be its flagship because it is effectively open and that will allow it bring in new members into the fold. You have to know that the clubs that are committing to the NPL are not going to just let the ECNL clubs just swoop back in and take competitive advantage of the situation. They are actively working to keep the ECNL separate in order to protect their business interests. The end result is the ECNL will continue being just what it is now, a league off doing their own thing, the only difference is all the energy will be over in the NPL because that is what USCS is pushing.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        Some would argue that USCS actually pulled the rug out from the ECNL clubs. They sanctioned the ECNL to pull the monster clubs in the country away from USYS and then once those clubs switched over they created the NPL and are putting all of their efforts into making it their top league.
                        If you're right, then ECNL will become less important over time, and the clubs will simply put their top teams into whatever league is highest at the time. No worries. USCS isn't going to screw the top teams from some of the biggest and most successful clubs.

                        Everyone knows that the majority of the top clubs have their best teams in ECNL at the present time, but things will evolve as they always do.

                        Bottom line: find a team that will develop your kid, and that plays in a league that will challenge her. Most likely, that will take her as far as her talent warrants.

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          If you're right, then ECNL will become less important over time, and the clubs will simply put their top teams into whatever league is highest at the time. No worries. USCS isn't going to screw the top teams from some of the biggest and most successful clubs.

                          Everyone knows that the majority of the top clubs have their best teams in ECNL at the present time, but things will evolve as they always do.

                          Bottom line: find a team that will develop your kid, and that plays in a league that will challenge her. Most likely, that will take her as far as her talent warrants.
                          Completely agree. My bet is the ECNL morphs into something small like the USYSA National League where entry is earned. I think what they will end up doing is merging the various ECNL/NPL regions under the NPL banner. In the end that will result in a much better competitive environment for all of the clubs.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            Completely agree. My bet is the ECNL morphs into something small like the USYSA National League where entry is earned. I think what they will end up doing is merging the various ECNL/NPL regions under the NPL banner. In the end that will result in a much better competitive environment for all of the clubs.
                            The one thing I've learned is that whatever the landscape is this year ... it may look entirely different next year.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              The one thing I've learned is that whatever the landscape is this year ... it may look entirely different next year.
                              Absolutely. So attach yourself to the right team, and your kid will likely end up in whatever league is appropriate. When you get to the recruiting years, the club will find a way to get the kids whatever exposure their abilities would justify. If you waste all of your energy targeting a slot on an ECNL team and your kid isn't really good enough to stand out in that competitive environment, you'll be doing her a disservice.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                                The one thing I've learned is that whatever the landscape is this year ... it may look entirely different next year.
                                Again, completely agree. That is one of the reasons I think you have to look at the business motives. What we have now is just a mess and doesn't appear sustainable. The business people will figure it that they are better off with everyone competing against each other as opposed to off on their own tangents. The NPL is where all of the action is going to be. What exactly that action is still remains to be seen.

                                Comment

                                Previously entered content was automatically saved. Restore or Discard.
                                Auto-Saved
                                x
                                Insert: Thumbnail Small Medium Large Fullsize Remove  
                                x
                                Working...
                                X