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“Bribery” and Ethics violations in ECNL/GDA/OYSA

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    “Bribery” and Ethics violations in ECNL/GDA/OYSA

    “I’m not sure we are talking about the same thing here. No one’s talking about good athletes or “youth soccer” generically. TS is littered with posts about using highly selective leagues like ECNL/DA as college pathways and, in fact, college and NT rosters are stacked with these players. Hard to imagine getting a roster spot on a top D1 program without it so it’s not just A pathway, it can be seen as the ONLY pathway for most. Many TS posts are about using club coaches as conduits or go-betweens with college coaches to skirt NCAA recruiting rules that don’t allow direct contact with players or parents. Not saying it happens frequently, but it’s not a hard mental leap to guess that some coaches or clubs do unethical, if not illegal, stuff to dole out those coveted spots and provide that college access. People are asking why these rich parents didn’t just take the bribe money and use it pay the tuition at Yale instead, but then Yale only accepts 5% of applicants so what they were really paying the bribe for was that access. Same thing for high-level club soccer, it’s really about access for some.

    In this case, the USC coach felt comfortable to funnel $350k of bribe money thru his private soccer club. Obviously that’s the only instance disclosed, but you can imagine that if he didn’t think that would throw up any red flags that it wasn’t the first time large amounts were funneled thru his club. And if he felt comfortable accepted bribes and bringing unqualified players to his university program, it’s not a hard mental leap to guess he would do that with his own club players or those at other clubs. Also, remember this USC, which is a top program that nobody thought would be doing this stuff. Now imagine what other club owners would do and what sorts of shenagins go on at less college programs that are outside the limelight.”

    The above is from another state. We have the Little DA scandal here and most likely unethical practices on the girls side as well. Considering the current national scandal, now is the time of scrutiny across the youth soccer scene and the time to demand ethical and equal treatment in youth soccer. I personally know of three local teams that are guilty of unethical favoritism (bought or not, I don’t know). Is this on every team? I don’t know but I suspect most. It is plain to see that access to the recruitment pathways and even high school play are being greased by favors/influence/friends/politics. Oregon soccer is such a low level nationally that it matters to no one else but it should matter to us Oregonian soccer parents. For example, missing a chance to play at a local d2/d3 because a boardmember’s child was played and marketed instead, is still a big deal to the other better players that missed that opportunity. We all lose when playing time & opportunities aren’t earned but are given or bought. Coaches, directors, & club board members & staff, now is the time to reassess and move forward in a fair and equitable way. Parents, particularly the wealthy and/or influential ones, now is the time to reassess and stop asking or demanding special treatment for your child. Parents, encourage your children to EARN their own accomplishments. Coaches and directors, please stop gifting away to the undeserved, what others have earned. Parents will stop asking for favors if they simply never given. We will ALL be better from it in the end.

    #2
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    “I’m not sure we are talking about the same thing here. No one’s talking about good athletes or “youth soccer” generically. TS is littered with posts about using highly selective leagues like ECNL/DA as college pathways and, in fact, college and NT rosters are stacked with these players. Hard to imagine getting a roster spot on a top D1 program without it so it’s not just A pathway, it can be seen as the ONLY pathway for most. Many TS posts are about using club coaches as conduits or go-betweens with college coaches to skirt NCAA recruiting rules that don’t allow direct contact with players or parents. Not saying it happens frequently, but it’s not a hard mental leap to guess that some coaches or clubs do unethical, if not illegal, stuff to dole out those coveted spots and provide that college access. People are asking why these rich parents didn’t just take the bribe money and use it pay the tuition at Yale instead, but then Yale only accepts 5% of applicants so what they were really paying the bribe for was that access. Same thing for high-level club soccer, it’s really about access for some.

    In this case, the USC coach felt comfortable to funnel $350k of bribe money thru his private soccer club. Obviously that’s the only instance disclosed, but you can imagine that if he didn’t think that would throw up any red flags that it wasn’t the first time large amounts were funneled thru his club. And if he felt comfortable accepted bribes and bringing unqualified players to his university program, it’s not a hard mental leap to guess he would do that with his own club players or those at other clubs. Also, remember this USC, which is a top program that nobody thought would be doing this stuff. Now imagine what other club owners would do and what sorts of shenagins go on at less college programs that are outside the limelight.”

    The above is from another state. We have the Little DA scandal here and most likely unethical practices on the girls side as well. Considering the current national scandal, now is the time of scrutiny across the youth soccer scene and the time to demand ethical and equal treatment in youth soccer. I personally know of three local teams that are guilty of unethical favoritism (bought or not, I don’t know). Is this on every team? I don’t know but I suspect most. It is plain to see that access to the recruitment pathways and even high school play are being greased by favors/influence/friends/politics. Oregon soccer is such a low level nationally that it matters to no one else but it should matter to us Oregonian soccer parents. For example, missing a chance to play at a local d2/d3 because a boardmember’s child was played and marketed instead, is still a big deal to the other better players that missed that opportunity. We all lose when playing time & opportunities aren’t earned but are given or bought. Coaches, directors, & club board members & staff, now is the time to reassess and move forward in a fair and equitable way. Parents, particularly the wealthy and/or influential ones, now is the time to reassess and stop asking or demanding special treatment for your child. Parents, encourage your children to EARN their own accomplishments. Coaches and directors, please stop gifting away to the undeserved, what others have earned. Parents will stop asking for favors if they simply never given. We will ALL be better from it in the end.
    Do you have any specific accusations? Which are the "three local teams" that are guilty that you personally know of?

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      Do you have any specific accusations? Which are the "three local teams" that are guilty that you personally know of?
      He doesn't know squat. It's just an opportunity to make anonymous accusations. Tryout season is coming up. Let the club bashing season begin!

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        Do you have any specific accusations? Which are the "three local teams" that are guilty that you personally know of?
        The three teams that cut his kid.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          “I’m not sure we are talking about the same thing here. No one’s talking about good athletes or “youth soccer” generically. TS is littered with posts about using highly selective leagues like ECNL/DA as college pathways and, in fact, college and NT rosters are stacked with these players. Hard to imagine getting a roster spot on a top D1 program without it so it’s not just A pathway, it can be seen as the ONLY pathway for most. Many TS posts are about using club coaches as conduits or go-betweens with college coaches to skirt NCAA recruiting rules that don’t allow direct contact with players or parents. Not saying it happens frequently, but it’s not a hard mental leap to guess that some coaches or clubs do unethical, if not illegal, stuff to dole out those coveted spots and provide that college access. People are asking why these rich parents didn’t just take the bribe money and use it pay the tuition at Yale instead, but then Yale only accepts 5% of applicants so what they were really paying the bribe for was that access. Same thing for high-level club soccer, it’s really about access for some.

          In this case, the USC coach felt comfortable to funnel $350k of bribe money thru his private soccer club. Obviously that’s the only instance disclosed, but you can imagine that if he didn’t think that would throw up any red flags that it wasn’t the first time large amounts were funneled thru his club. And if he felt comfortable accepted bribes and bringing unqualified players to his university program, it’s not a hard mental leap to guess he would do that with his own club players or those at other clubs. Also, remember this USC, which is a top program that nobody thought would be doing this stuff. Now imagine what other club owners would do and what sorts of shenagins go on at less college programs that are outside the limelight.”

          The above is from another state. We have the Little DA scandal here and most likely unethical practices on the girls side as well. Considering the current national scandal, now is the time of scrutiny across the youth soccer scene and the time to demand ethical and equal treatment in youth soccer. I personally know of three local teams that are guilty of unethical favoritism (bought or not, I don’t know). Is this on every team? I don’t know but I suspect most. It is plain to see that access to the recruitment pathways and even high school play are being greased by favors/influence/friends/politics. Oregon soccer is such a low level nationally that it matters to no one else but it should matter to us Oregonian soccer parents. For example, missing a chance to play at a local d2/d3 because a boardmember’s child was played and marketed instead, is still a big deal to the other better players that missed that opportunity. We all lose when playing time & opportunities aren’t earned but are given or bought. Coaches, directors, & club board members & staff, now is the time to reassess and move forward in a fair and equitable way. Parents, particularly the wealthy and/or influential ones, now is the time to reassess and stop asking or demanding special treatment for your child. Parents, encourage your children to EARN their own accomplishments. Coaches and directors, please stop gifting away to the undeserved, what others have earned. Parents will stop asking for favors if they simply never given. We will ALL be better from it in the end.
          Duhh. This happens everywhere. Who hasn’t been on a team where the manager or board members kid didn’t get special treatment? Where the kid whose parents donate big time to the club don’t get special treatment? Where the coach’s friend’s kid didn’t get special treatment. Where influential parents didn’t whine and try to manipulate their kid into starting, playing more minutes, on the A team, preferred position? I’ve seen this on almost every team my kids have played on. Over the years, two coaches stand out as refusing to play that game. Every team my kids have been a part of have had “those parents”. None of it is technically illegal so it will never stop. Sad but true.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            Duhh. This happens everywhere. Who hasn’t been on a team where the manager or board members kid didn’t get special treatment? Where the kid whose parents donate big time to the club don’t get special treatment? Where the coach’s friend’s kid didn’t get special treatment. Where influential parents didn’t whine and try to manipulate their kid into starting, playing more minutes, on the A team, preferred position? I’ve seen this on almost every team my kids have played on. Over the years, two coaches stand out as refusing to play that game. Every team my kids have been a part of have had “those parents”. None of it is technically illegal so it will never stop. Sad but true.
            There will always parents who try to wield influence. See the current scandal. Many coaches are too weak and cave. The coaches that stand their ground do better in the long run and so do their teams.

            As a side note, I’ve also seen nice coaches feel sorry for the long time player that has petered out or been replaced by a new player or late bloomer and continue to favor the old player without being pushed by the parents. It’s sad all around and never ends well. Superior play on the pitch doesn’t lie and they only delay the inevitable. Everyone can’t always win a trophy, or start, or make the A team, or get recruited to a top or even mid level college. That’s the sad fact of life.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              Do you have any specific accusations? Which are the "three local teams" that are guilty that you personally know of?
              He/She is talking about TA. Last years 2005 U13 team was bought and paid for by Ben Billups. Ben also financed the 2004 team last year, and the 2006 team this year. This financing came with the stipulation that his son (Draco Malfoy) and his son's friends be included on the team, and that his son's personal trainer coach (who Ben flew up from Brazil) be the head coach for TA.

              Ben had done this before at U12 with ADF. Again, with the same stipulations that his son be on the first team. It worked for half a year, before Joaquin got out of business with Billups, and half of the team left with Billups, the coach (Fernando) and the son Draco Malfoy.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                He/She is talking about TA. Last years 2005 U13 team was bought and paid for by Ben Billups. Ben also financed the 2004 team last year, and the 2006 team this year. This financing came with the stipulation that his son (Draco Malfoy) and his son's friends be included on the team, and that his son's personal trainer coach (who Ben flew up from Brazil) be the head coach for TA.

                Ben had done this before at U12 with ADF. Again, with the same stipulations that his son be on the first team. It worked for half a year, before Joaquin got out of business with Billups, and half of the team left with Billups, the coach (Fernando) and the son Draco Malfoy.
                It is not really a ethics issue. It was a business transaction and everyone knew what is up. It is not like he was hiding what he was trying to do.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  “I’m not sure we are talking about the same thing here. No one’s talking about good athletes or “youth soccer” generically. TS is littered with posts about using highly selective leagues like ECNL/DA as college pathways and, in fact, college and NT rosters are stacked with these players. Hard to imagine getting a roster spot on a top D1 program without it so it’s not just A pathway, it can be seen as the ONLY pathway for most. Many TS posts are about using club coaches as conduits or go-betweens with college coaches to skirt NCAA recruiting rules that don’t allow direct contact with players or parents. Not saying it happens frequently, but it’s not a hard mental leap to guess that some coaches or clubs do unethical, if not illegal, stuff to dole out those coveted spots and provide that college access. People are asking why these rich parents didn’t just take the bribe money and use it pay the tuition at Yale instead, but then Yale only accepts 5% of applicants so what they were really paying the bribe for was that access. Same thing for high-level club soccer, it’s really about access for some.

                  In this case, the USC coach felt comfortable to funnel $350k of bribe money thru his private soccer club. Obviously that’s the only instance disclosed, but you can imagine that if he didn’t think that would throw up any red flags that it wasn’t the first time large amounts were funneled thru his club. And if he felt comfortable accepted bribes and bringing unqualified players to his university program, it’s not a hard mental leap to guess he would do that with his own club players or those at other clubs. Also, remember this USC, which is a top program that nobody thought would be doing this stuff. Now imagine what other club owners would do and what sorts of shenagins go on at less college programs that are outside the limelight.”

                  The above is from another state. We have the Little DA scandal here and most likely unethical practices on the girls side as well. Considering the current national scandal, now is the time of scrutiny across the youth soccer scene and the time to demand ethical and equal treatment in youth soccer. I personally know of three local teams that are guilty of unethical favoritism (bought or not, I don’t know). Is this on every team? I don’t know but I suspect most. It is plain to see that access to the recruitment pathways and even high school play are being greased by favors/influence/friends/politics. Oregon soccer is such a low level nationally that it matters to no one else but it should matter to us Oregonian soccer parents. For example, missing a chance to play at a local d2/d3 because a boardmember’s child was played and marketed instead, is still a big deal to the other better players that missed that opportunity. We all lose when playing time & opportunities aren’t earned but are given or bought. Coaches, directors, & club board members & staff, now is the time to reassess and move forward in a fair and equitable way. Parents, particularly the wealthy and/or influential ones, now is the time to reassess and stop asking or demanding special treatment for your child. Parents, encourage your children to EARN their own accomplishments. Coaches and directors, please stop gifting away to the undeserved, what others have earned. Parents will stop asking for favors if they simply never given. We will ALL be better from it in the end.
                  "and most likely unethical practices on the girls side as well. "

                  This sounds like a big guess.

                  If your kid is missing a chance at a local d2/d3 program then your kid is probably not all that great to begin with.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    There will always parents who try to wield influence. See the current scandal. Many coaches are too weak and cave. The coaches that stand their ground do better in the long run and so do their teams.

                    As a side note, I’ve also seen nice coaches feel sorry for the long time player that has petered out or been replaced by a new player or late bloomer and continue to favor the old player without being pushed by the parents. It’s sad all around and never ends well. Superior play on the pitch doesn’t lie and they only delay the inevitable. Everyone can’t always win a trophy, or start, or make the A team, or get recruited to a top or even mid level college. That’s the sad fact of life.
                    Don’t know about bribery per se but have seen lots of influence & pressure politics by donors/board/mmanagers/parents of kids who do privates. A good coach won’t bow down to the pressure. If it’s happening a lot on your team, find a new coach that is strong enough to stand up to parental pressure/influence.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      He/She is talking about TA. Last years 2005 U13 team was bought and paid for by Ben Billups. Ben also financed the 2004 team last year, and the 2006 team this year. This financing came with the stipulation that his son (Draco Malfoy) and his son's friends be included on the team, and that his son's personal trainer coach (who Ben flew up from Brazil) be the head coach for TA.

                      Ben had done this before at U12 with ADF. Again, with the same stipulations that his son be on the first team. It worked for half a year, before Joaquin got out of business with Billups, and half of the team left with Billups, the coach (Fernando) and the son Draco Malfoy.
                      I'm sorry but as a non-Portland parent this seems so ridiculous. You live in a city with literally a half dozen good club options. If this dad did all you say, why on earth would you stay with this club?

                      You parents in a large metro area have the power to force clubs to be ethical. If they aren't, take your business elsewhere. If enough of you do that, the unethical clubs are run out of town and the ethical ones are rewarded.

                      I can see this being an issue in an outlying area like Bend or Eugene or Medford - where a parent has one premier club option within a reasonable driving distance. But to allow yourselves to be held hostage when you have so many other good choices speaks to your foolishness, not the dishonesty of the clubs.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        You live in a city with literally a half dozen good club options.
                        Well there's the flaw in your thinking right there. Portland is a soccer-mad city, with amazing facilities, and dog crap for quality in terms of coaching and clubs.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          I'm sorry but as a non-Portland parent this seems so ridiculous. You live in a city with literally a half dozen good club options. If this dad did all you say, why on earth would you stay with this club?

                          You parents in a large metro area have the power to force clubs to be ethical. If they aren't, take your business elsewhere. If enough of you do that, the unethical clubs are run out of town and the ethical ones are rewarded.

                          I can see this being an issue in an outlying area like Bend or Eugene or Medford - where a parent has one premier club option within a reasonable driving distance. But to allow yourselves to be held hostage when you have so many other good choices speaks to your foolishness, not the dishonesty of the clubs.
                          TA is largely free - some families/clubs don't support for a variety of reasons; others hold their noses and accept it for what it is. Its not like the daddy thing is hidden - fairly out in the open at TA, so folks know what they are signing up for (not defending it all, just it isn't a secret).

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            Don’t know about bribery per se but have seen lots of influence & pressure politics by donors/board/mmanagers/parents of kids who do privates. A good coach won’t bow down to the pressure. If it’s happening a lot on your team, find a new coach that is strong enough to stand up to parental pressure/influence.
                            If the coach doesn’t let parents bully or influence them, problem solved.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              TA is largely free - some families/clubs don't support for a variety of reasons; others hold their noses and accept it for what it is. Its not like the daddy thing is hidden - fairly out in the open at TA, so folks know what they are signing up for (not defending it all, just it isn't a secret).
                              So if you are getting something that is "largely free," you give up your right to complain or criticize. Either move on and pay for something better quality or live with your choice and remember you get what you (don't) pay for.

                              Comment

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