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    #31
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    No, idiot, you missed the 2nd part of what I said. It’s training AND EVALUATION that separates the US from successful foreign programs. You can give someone the best training all day, everyday; but that will NOT make them a good player. Unless you properly evaluate players and either correct, promote, or demote them then it is pointless. The US doesn’t train and it doesn’t evaluate properly and that is why it loses to countries that are in no other way better than the US.
    You’re overthinking things. Soccer is a girl’s sport in America.

    Comment


      #32
      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      The issue is that Greater Manchester (UK) 233 clubs for 12 year olds to play soccer, year round, 99% of them as their primary sport. Plus every middle school has a year round soccer team. Plus most of the coaches are experienced volunteers. Plus regional and select teams are free.

      Pay-to-play and profit driven clubs are hamstringing soccer development in the US.

      Well, you make some important in-roads and points.
      1. this is something that American soccer experts like Mr Gans (local 'guru' who wants to be president of soccer) doesn't get. Soccer is a way of life for the youth in England and other successful countries. It is part of their fabric. The coaches were brought up in the system and now they are bringing up the current generation. It is free up until a point at which time the clubs pay into it....and they can since they are huge businesses. It would be like the Patriots funding youth football in Massachusetts.....hahaha....not a bad idea actually. Kraft has enough money. They don't play 'too much' in Manchester. They simply play all the time. Some kids move up and some don't. Basketball, hockey, baseball, American football, lacrosse don't really exist.
      2. 'Pay to play'. tough one to address. Aside from the massively successful teams like the Patriots who might be able to fund youth football, how would you suggest American youth soccer happen every day by experienced coaches for free? Perhaps AOC has an answer?? I don't have the answer other than to just tell the little messi's and mia's to go out and play every day. If a parent or two has some time they can supervise. However, it is tough to tell a country of 350 million to follow the same direction as a country of 55 million (England) and to provide the exact same resources and for free.
      3. I get your point...you want everyone to have access and to play soccer everyday and not worry about costs. You just stated that Manchester alone has 233 clubs for 12 year olds. Manchester is 44.6 square miles. There are 5 clubs per square mile and nothing else for 12 year olds to do. The United States will never get that going. They don't even have that with the most popular sports.
      4. What the self-proclaimed gurus of the soccer intelligencia miss is that the US might consider another approach. One in which combines what they have now with another opportunity. The latter is going to have to be self-promoted and not rely on a governing body to make it happen, which is what the new socialists feel is necessary. To support one thing that Gans said, it has to come from within. The kids have to have the joy and passion....but it is not created from the outside. The kids have to simply go out with their friends every day and 'fool' around with the ball and the game. Perhaps....and I mean perhaps, the club's coaches might consider organizing some free sessions to bolster this..... but, their time is valuable..

      Comment


        #33
        Above: I've been saying for years we are not Europe and need to stop trying to emulate something we can never reproduce. Absolutely there are things to be learned from international systems and clubs, but we need to adapt to our own U.S. reality. We don't have the culture, a college education is the goal for most, we don't have the pro club infrastructure or level of money abroad, pay to pay is our reality, and our massive geography is unavoidable.

        Comment


          #34
          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          Well, you make some important in-roads and points.
          1. this is something that American soccer experts like Mr Gans (local 'guru' who wants to be president of soccer) doesn't get. Soccer is a way of life for the youth in England and other successful countries. It is part of their fabric. The coaches were brought up in the system and now they are bringing up the current generation. It is free up until a point at which time the clubs pay into it....and they can since they are huge businesses. It would be like the Patriots funding youth football in Massachusetts.....hahaha....not a bad idea actually. Kraft has enough money. They don't play 'too much' in Manchester. They simply play all the time. Some kids move up and some don't. Basketball, hockey, baseball, American football, lacrosse don't really exist.
          2. 'Pay to play'. tough one to address. Aside from the massively successful teams like the Patriots who might be able to fund youth football, how would you suggest American youth soccer happen every day by experienced coaches for free? Perhaps AOC has an answer?? I don't have the answer other than to just tell the little messi's and mia's to go out and play every day. If a parent or two has some time they can supervise. However, it is tough to tell a country of 350 million to follow the same direction as a country of 55 million (England) and to provide the exact same resources and for free.
          3. I get your point...you want everyone to have access and to play soccer everyday and not worry about costs. You just stated that Manchester alone has 233 clubs for 12 year olds. Manchester is 44.6 square miles. There are 5 clubs per square mile and nothing else for 12 year olds to do. The United States will never get that going. They don't even have that with the most popular sports.
          4. What the self-proclaimed gurus of the soccer intelligencia miss is that the US might consider another approach. One in which combines what they have now with another opportunity. The latter is going to have to be self-promoted and not rely on a governing body to make it happen, which is what the new socialists feel is necessary. To support one thing that Gans said, it has to come from within. The kids have to have the joy and passion....but it is not created from the outside. The kids have to simply go out with their friends every day and 'fool' around with the ball and the game. Perhaps....and I mean perhaps, the club's coaches might consider organizing some free sessions to bolster this..... but, their time is valuable..
          Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has the solution to soccer problems in the US.

          Easily the early favorite for most ignorant post of 2019. I'd actually give it the award for all time. And that's saying something for this site.

          Comment


            #35
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has the solution to soccer problems in the US.

            Easily the early favorite for most ignorant post of 2019. I'd actually give it the award for all time. And that's saying something for this site.
            New phone...who dis?

            Comment


              #36
              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              You’re overthinking things. Soccer is a girl’s sport in America.
              And boy do they suck at it...getting outplayed by nations that are smaller who spend 1% what USSF spend.

              Comment


                #37
                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                2. 'Pay to play'. tough one to address. Aside from the massively successful teams like the Patriots who might be able to fund youth football, how would you suggest American youth soccer happen every day by experienced coaches for free? Perhaps AOC has an answer?? I don't have the answer other than to just tell the little messi's and mia's to go out and play every day. If a parent or two has some time they can supervise. However, it is tough to tell a country of 350 million to follow the same direction as a country of 55 million (England) and to provide the exact same resources and for free.
                There are efforts here and there to open up competitive soccer to be accessible to all:

                https://www.nhpr.org/post/low-cost-h...on-opportunity

                Comment


                  #38
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  There are efforts here and there to open up competitive soccer to be accessible to all:

                  https://www.nhpr.org/post/low-cost-h...on-opportunity
                  I like this article. It is a good approach to expanding accessibility. Another poster mentioned soccer being a girl’s sport in the US, but I did read an interesting article a couple years ago (wish I could find it again) about someone trying to start a similar club for poor girls in Boston neighborhoods. The problem they were running into was cultural chauvinism and that these girls were working at very young ages in family businesses or as child caregivers to younger siblings. The families, which were largely Latino or Asian, didn’t think it was worthwhile for girls to play or couldn’t afford to give up the free labor. The article touched on why so many club and college teams are loaded with richer white girls when there are so many talented girls of color who come from countries where soccer is king.

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    The article touched on why so many club and college teams are loaded with richer white girls when there are so many talented girls of color who come from countries where soccer is king.

                    Not to sound insensitive...but...so?

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      I like this article. It is a good approach to expanding accessibility. Another poster mentioned soccer being a girl’s sport in the US, but I did read an interesting article a couple years ago (wish I could find it again) about someone trying to start a similar club for poor girls in Boston neighborhoods. The problem they were running into was cultural chauvinism and that these girls were working at very young ages in family businesses or as child caregivers to younger siblings. The families, which were largely Latino or Asian, didn’t think it was worthwhile for girls to play or couldn’t afford to give up the free labor. The article touched on why so many club and college teams are loaded with richer white girls when there are so many talented girls of color who come from countries where soccer is king.
                      That has been a huge issue in Latin American countries as well and it's gotten international press coverage - girls who want to play but few opportunities for them because the focus is on the boys. For a few years my son played on a very culturally diverse team, a mini UN practically. The sisters of all the Hispanic players didn't really play sports unless it was on school teams.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        Not to sound insensitive...but...so?
                        If you think locking out potentially great players because of cost isn't an issue then soccer is the sport for you!

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          If you think locking out potentially great players because of cost isn't an issue then soccer is the sport for you!

                          That's not what was posted. It was that they are working and led me to believe there was no time.

                          Are you suggesting we subsidize people's work to them allow them to play?

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            That's not what was posted. It was that they are working and led me to believe there was no time.

                            Are you suggesting we subsidize people's work to them allow them to play?
                            I don’t think it’s that there is no time - if they have a son they make the time rather than making them work or babysit whereas if they have a daughter they don’t try. Call it culture or whatever, some of those families look at girls as lesser than boys so they don’t have equal support at home. If the OP said that soccer is a girls sport in the US, I guess this clarifies that only certain girls are represented.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              I don’t think it’s that there is no time - if they have a son they make the time rather than making them work or babysit whereas if they have a daughter they don’t try. Call it culture or whatever, some of those families look at girls as lesser than boys so they don’t have equal support at home. If the OP said that soccer is a girls sport in the US, I guess this clarifies that only certain girls are represented.
                              I guess I'll go back to my inquiry...so?

                              I'm not sure what we are getting at, and not trying to be argumentative. If those with a "culture" in the game come here, and their parents aren't allowing them to play for either it being a boy's game, or because they have familial responsibilities...why is that the rich white girls problem?

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                                Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has the solution to soccer problems in the US.

                                Easily the early favorite for most ignorant post of 2019. I'd actually give it the award for all time. And that's saying something for this site.
                                First, seriously? you couldn't tell the sarcasm regarding AOC? Unless you really think she does. Maybe the post touched a nerve and you are just upset.
                                Second, the post is good and realistic in that instead of continuously modeling after the rest of the world, whose populations are 1/7 or smaller than the US, the US should find its own way. That way will have to involve self motivation as club coaches are not going to simply go out on their own and run daily practices without getting paid more. Yes...we have a pay to play and a pay for a coach system.
                                Third, soccer is not as well paid as the other major sports. this is a simple fact. In this country, soccer is NOT the number one sport and the US does not have the desire to put major personnel and financial efforts to make it a top sport. College basketball and football get more media attention. Heck, college gymnastics may also!!!

                                Comment

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