Men's National Team Stagnation - MLS to Blame?

[Unregistered]

It's not a best athlete problem, or coaching problem. It's a time on the ball problem. Kids from soccer power countries are playing 20+hrs every week. Ours are playing about 6 only during season. Unless our kids start playing closer to that 20hr per week average, nothing is going to change.

Chile was about 80th 10 years ago, now is 5th, and just beat no. 1. Argentina made the US look silly. Any kid playing serious club is playing closer to 20 than 6. Gotta be more to it than that.

[Unregistered]

Chile was about 80th 10 years ago, now is 5th, and just beat no. 1. Argentina made the US look silly. Any kid playing serious club is playing closer to 20 than 6. Gotta be more to it than that.

The rest of the world lives and breathes soccer. Kids in dirt fields, garbage dumps, concrete, streets, they are playing. other countries don't care about women's soccer or they would be better too. Our athletes are just athletic just not as skilled.

[Unregistered]

You lose the argument and all credibility when we make stupid statements about how much better the USMNT would be if the kids were playing HS soccer. There's no other sport where, except possibly football (and that's debatable for many positions), the kids benefit from a quality perspective playing HS sports as opposed to club or individual training.
I do agree it's the lack of technical training at the younger ages and there is no magic bullet. But blaming it on DAP is a fallacy. Correlation doesn't imply causation - far too simplistic.

Instead of insults why not just answer my very simple question? (we both know why)

[Unregistered]

Instead of insults why not just answer my very simple question? (we both know why)

You're too stupid to converse with. (That's why)

[Unregistered]

World Cup
Appearances 10 (First in 1930)
Best result Third place, 1930

Copa América
Appearances 4 (First in 1993)
Best result Fourth place, 1995, 2016

CONCACAF Championship
& Gold Cup
Appearances 13 (First in 1985)
Best result Champions, 1991, 2002, 2005, 2007, 2013

Confederations Cup
Appearances 4 (First in 1992)
Best result Runners-up, 2009

What is the trend? Pretty much nothing. People bitch and moan about the lack of progress about the development of US men's soccer and how "something" needs to be done, and then when things like DAP take place, they bitch and moan even more. How about just continuing the growth of soccer and the desire for some (not all) of the best athletes to take of the sport at a young age and continue with it. When you have athletes like Bradley still playing such critical positions for the USMNT, it's a pretty good sign that little has changed in 80 years. MLS and DAP certainly are not magic bullets, but one of those doesn't exist.

Folks are critical of MLS because since inception it hasn't improved the national team and it is mediocre league in a large/wealthy country, even after 20 years. It doesn't help that the commish makes laughable claims that it will be among the worlds elite in a decade, when it pays so little for other than over the hill Europeans and has made zero progress relative to MX.

Want to believe in DA - however the results of our youth national teams are worse than in the era immediately before its rollout. Those results are not intuitive, but disappointing nonetheless.

[Unregistered]

The rest of the world lives and breathes soccer. Kids in dirt fields, garbage dumps, concrete, streets, they are playing. other countries don't care about women's soccer or they would be better too. Our athletes are just athletic just not as skilled.

Are you telling me that 10 years ago kids in Chile were "not playing on dirt fields, garbage dumps, concrete, streets..." and that now they are, which is why there has been such a dramatic change in Chilean soccer at the national level? I have to think there was more a concerted effort at the national level. The NY Times noted that "Chile was one of the nations that recognized how important it was to place its best talent overseas. By 2010 Chilean stars were getting their foot in the door in Turkey, Greece, and Germany, starting what has become an exodus of talent. The result was a stronger national team." 13 of the Chilean stars now play primarily in Europe. Yet, when Klinsmann makes the statement that some players should bypass the MLS and play in Europe some people want to run him out of town. Playing with the best instills the best. The DAP is a good start, IMO, but the future stars like Pulisic need to get/stay abroad - maybe the MLS mid-career.

On the athletic front, I just disagree. There are some fantastic athletes on the US squad and I hope the transition continues. However, players like Bradley simply are not in the same category athletically as players on premier teams. Time to move on.

[Unregistered]

Instead of insults why not just answer my very simple question? (we both know why)

I did address your question, which was based on some false cause and effect premise, i.e., that because (a) the DAP has been around for 10 years, and (b) that the US has not gotten better over 10 years, the DAP program must be the cause. That's way too simplistic. Maybe the DAP isn't helping as much as you would like, but to blame a decline in the USMNT (which is debatable) with the DAP is nonsense. Beyond that, what is your answer? If a player doesn't want to play abroad, there are not a lot of options and the DAP is a start. Play HS soccer? Are you frickin kidding me? That's why it's hard to give your responses any credibility.

[Unregistered]

Are you telling me that 10 years ago kids in Chile were "not playing on dirt fields, garbage dumps, concrete, streets..." and that now they are, which is why there has been such a dramatic change in Chilean soccer at the national level? I have to think there was more a concerted effort at the national level. The NY Times noted that "Chile was one of the nations that recognized how important it was to place its best talent overseas. By 2010 Chilean stars were getting their foot in the door in Turkey, Greece, and Germany, starting what has become an exodus of talent. The result was a stronger national team." 13 of the Chilean stars now play primarily in Europe. Yet, when Klinsmann makes the statement that some players should bypass the MLS and play in Europe some people want to run him out of town. Playing with the best instills the best. The DAP is a good start, IMO, but the future stars like Pulisic need to get/stay abroad - maybe the MLS mid-career.

****

^^^^^^THIS IS SPOT ON^^^^^^^^

Read quotes from Conte, Mexico's national team coach, even Pirlo - having US' best players play in MLS serves MLS' commercial interests, it does not serve US National Team's interest.

Klismann is a mediocre coach and hasn't moved the needle as a technical director - HOWEVER, he provides a necessary critique of the US System and has brought a much needed change in mentality.

[Unregistered]

^^^^^^THIS IS SPOT ON^^^^^^^^

Read quotes from Conte, Mexico's national team coach, even Pirlo - having US' best players play in MLS serves MLS' commercial interests, it does not serve US National Team's interest.

Klismann is a mediocre coach and hasn't moved the needle as a technical director - HOWEVER, he provides a necessary critique of the US System and has brought a much needed change in mentality.

curious, what's the change in mentality?

[Unregistered]

curious, what's the change in mentality?

(i) Looking critically at the development and competitive environment that MLS offers and generally speaking his mind (not afraid to point out its deficiencies), and
(ii) generally rejecting American exceptionalism when it comes to how system/leagues should be organized.

[Unregistered]

(i) Looking critically at the development and competitive environment that MLS offers and generally speaking his mind (not afraid to point out its deficiencies), and
(ii) generally rejecting American exceptionalism when it comes to how system/leagues should be organized.

ok. i thought you meant a change in mentality for the national team. not the national league. but ok.

[Unregistered]

(i) Looking critically at the development and competitive environment that MLS offers and generally speaking his mind (not afraid to point out its deficiencies), and
(ii) generally rejecting American exceptionalism when it comes to how system/leagues should be organized.

Hey, here's an idea!

Fix the damn problem here rather than simply say that the MLS stinks so go to Europe as a 21 year old.

Klinnsman and his apologists are pitiful. His one answer is 'MLS stinks, go to Europe'.

Klinnsman should get off his lazy, know nothing butt and constantly be showing up at youth practices showing players and coaches exactly what the differences are in training that separates these 'extraordinary' European teams from the US teams.

We'll even kick in a couple more bucks to the millions you're already stealing from us.

Fix the damn problem before it's a problem rather than send the patient to the emergency room when it's too late.

[Unregistered]

^^^^^^THIS IS SPOT ON^^^^^^^^

Read quotes from Conte, Mexico's national team coach, even Pirlo - having US' best players play in MLS serves MLS' commercial interests, it does not serve US National Team's interest.

Klismann is a mediocre coach and hasn't moved the needle as a technical director - HOWEVER, he provides a necessary critique of the US System and has brought a much needed change in mentality.

Agreeing with yourself is pitiful.

[Unregistered]

Hey, here's an idea!

Fix the damn problem here rather than simply say that the MLS stinks so go to Europe as a 21 year old.

Klinnsman and his apologists are pitiful. His one answer is 'MLS stinks, go to Europe'.

Klinnsman should get off his lazy, know nothing butt and constantly be showing up at youth practices showing players and coaches exactly what the differences are in training that separates these 'extraordinary' European teams from the US teams.

We'll even kick in a couple more bucks to the millions you're already stealing from us.

Fix the damn problem before it's a problem rather than send the patient to the emergency room when it's too late.

JFC, some people are so stupid - typical know-nothing fan. Yeah, that's a great use of time and solves the problems - Klinsmann showing up at youth practices. What is it you know that the myriad of coaches and national orgs in Chile, Iceland and virtually every up and coming national program doesn't know? BTW, he has never said anything remotely like "MLS stinks, go to Europe." It helps because (yes, I know you hate to admit it) the European programs are extraordinary compared to the US programs. That does not mean don't develop and don't have programs like the DAP's.

[Unregistered]

Hey, here's an idea!

Fix the damn problem here rather than simply say that the MLS stinks so go to Europe as a 21 year old.

Klinnsman and his apologists are pitiful. His one answer is 'MLS stinks, go to Europe'.

Klinnsman should get off his lazy, know nothing butt and constantly be showing up at youth practices showing players and coaches exactly what the differences are in training that separates these 'extraordinary' European teams from the US teams.

We'll even kick in a couple more bucks to the millions you're already stealing from us.

Fix the damn problem before it's a problem rather than send the patient to the emergency room when it's too late.

Not a Klinnsman apologist as a coach and think he is average: weak tactically, above average in terms of motivation, effective in finding European players who can play for the US.

Just appreciate the critical voice he has brought to US Soccer, particularly from within the US Soccer apparatus - extremely rare.

It is not within Klinnsman's control to fix some of the aspects he is most critical of - lack of promotion/relegation, chaotic style of play in MLS, lack of adherence to international calendar in MLS, pay-to-play youth model.

Support Klinnsman because he provides an important voice. Further the fact that he has so thoroughly pissed of MLS owners means he is hitting a nerve.