2015/16 National League Performance: ECNL v. Timbers

[Unregistered]

Points per game below for Oregon ECNL (girls) and Timbers DA (boys) at u16 and u18 levels. Only including where both ECNL and Timbers are playing in a national league:

u18
FC Portland 1.21
Timbers 1.0
Crossfire United .86

u16
Crossfire 1.23
FC Portland 1.08
Timbers .71

Would be interesting to compare college placements.

[Unregistered]

Skewed comparison

Points per game below for Oregon ECNL (girls) and Timbers DA (boys) at u16 and u18 levels. Only including where both ECNL and Timbers are playing in a national league:

u18
FC Portland 1.21
Timbers 1.0
Crossfire United .86

u16
Crossfire 1.23
FC Portland 1.08
Timbers .71

Would be interesting to compare college placements.

Can't compare college placements as girls programs at the d1 level hand out scholarships nearly at a two to one ratio.
333 D1 schools for Girls x 14 scholarships 4,600 .
206 D1 teams for Men x 9.9 2039 scholarships.
Granted not every school is fully funded.
But keep in mind dividing up 14 scholarships across a full squad goes much further than 9.9.

At the Division II there are 200 Mens team and 280 girls teams.

DIII offers no athletic scholarships

NAIA is about the only level where the boys and girls are on equal footing with the number of teams 190 Men & 191 Women as America Football is not a prevalent at NAIA like it is at D1 and D2 which creates the scholarship for girls due to Gender equity and the reality the American Football has 80+ scholarships

Bottom line non-elite girls soccer players will get scholarships based on demand. Whereas boys that are non-elite will not. So comparisons really can't be made when a mid level girls will get a scholarship and the boy really has no chance due to title IX funding.

Comparing the wide range of great teams to below average teams in the expansive ECNL league compared to the DA which has capped at 79 of the most elite clubs in the nation is really not a comparison.

So there are around 160 Teams in the DA across 2 age groups U16 & u18..

Whereas the ECNL has over 320 teams across 4 age groups and is watered down due to have a league at u15, u16, u17 & u18

(1) DA Boys program in a bona fide elite level do struggle mightily.

(2) Local girls clubs playing in a nation wide open league struggle even more against lessor competition than the DA has.

It is what it is.

[Unregistered]

Timbers DA is struggling on virtually any metric (players on the first team, W/Ls, college placement) . . . v. Oregon ECNL or other DA programs.

Population they pull from has something to do with it, but the comparison to Washington DA programs is not pretty:

Timbers have a monopoly in a metro of 2.3 million; Washington 2 HS DA programs in area with 3.7 million . . . despite that advantage underperforms both the MLS and non-MLS DA up there in terms of producing pro players and wins/losses.

Contrast that with Oregon/Washington ECNL which this year had 2 teams in each market.

[Unregistered]

Can't compare college placements as girls programs at the d1 level hand out scholarships nearly at a two to one ratio.
333 D1 schools for Girls x 14 scholarships 4,600 .
206 D1 teams for Men x 9.9 2039 scholarships.
Granted not every school is fully funded.
But keep in mind dividing up 14 scholarships across a full squad goes much further than 9.9.

At the Division II there are 200 Mens team and 280 girls teams.

DIII offers no athletic scholarships

NAIA is about the only level where the boys and girls are on equal footing with the number of teams 190 Men & 191 Women as America Football is not a prevalent at NAIA like it is at D1 and D2 which creates the scholarship for girls due to Gender equity and the reality the American Football has 80+ scholarships

Bottom line non-elite girls soccer players will get scholarships based on demand. Whereas boys that are non-elite will not. So comparisons really can't be made when a mid level girls will get a scholarship and the boy really has no chance due to title IX funding.

Comparing the wide range of great teams to below average teams in the expansive ECNL league compared to the DA which has capped at 79 of the most elite clubs in the nation is really not a comparison.

So there are around 160 Teams in the DA across 2 age groups U16 & u18..

Whereas the ECNL has over 320 teams across 4 age groups and is watered down due to have a league at u15, u16, u17 & u18

(1) DA Boys program in a bona fide elite level do struggle mightily.

(2) Local girls clubs playing in a nation wide open league struggle even more against lessor competition than the DA has.

It is what it is.

This is interesting and all, but there is a difference between college placement and college scholarship. For that matter, how about details about academic versus athletic awards, combination of both, and how those awards factor into where an athlete might end up making a written commitment.

[Unregistered]

Points per game below for Oregon ECNL (girls) and Timbers DA (boys) at u16 and u18 levels. Only including where both ECNL and Timbers are playing in a national league:

u18
FC Portland 1.21
Timbers 1.0
Crossfire United .86

u16
Crossfire 1.23
FC Portland 1.08
Timbers .71

Would be interesting to compare college placements.

I think this a stupid question, but college placement isnt even close. Maybe it is because more scholly's available on the girls side, but CU has more placements on 1 team than all of the Academy

Boys
http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/searc...ea=commitments

Girls
http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/searc...ea=commitments

[Unregistered]

Consider this. It's extremely difficult to get a boys scholarship vs girls.

Timbers academy has placed kids in Akron, Duke, etc. BoyS DA is for the elite.

Ecnl is watered down now with teams with G/D of -32 that don't score more than 3 goals a year. It's a poor development model and the boys DA would never allow that.

Boys timbers DA pays 500$ Bond.


Girls Ecnl is a borderline scam at 10k a year. Clubs overload rosters and cut playing time down to a 1/3 because they need to manage costs.

Boys DA tend to develop their players from U14 on. The ecnl clubs especially Fc Portland don't develop and sick their parents and coaches to recruit to replace.

Boys DA is thriving. Ecnl is becoming more obsolete especially with girls DA coming in.

Yes your local club is applying. Imagine Fc applying for a girls DA spot after screwing families on this Ecnl scam just to recruit gullible parents on something their kid would have gotten otherwise.

[Unregistered]

Timbers DA is struggling on virtually any metric (players on the first team, W/Ls, college placement) . . . v. Oregon ECNL or other DA programs.

Population they pull from has something to do with it, but the comparison to Washington DA programs is not pretty:

Timbers have a monopoly in a metro of 2.3 million; Washington 2 HS DA programs in area with 3.7 million . . . despite that advantage underperforms both the MLS and non-MLS DA up there in terms of producing pro players and wins/losses.

Contrast that with Oregon/Washington ECNL which this year had 2 teams in each market.

Boys have many disadvantages compared to girls, the biggest is they don't focus on academics like girls do. That's one of the reasons it's easy for an average girls player to get a scholarship they get great grades and test scores. The male counterpart unfortunately relies on their on the field ability to often and has no takers at that level then they compound it with crap grades.

The Portland market does produce a few Boys playing at the top level of D1 soccer, Youth Nat and MLS does produce some studs every few years, at a much better clip than the Portland area girls side which has no such presence at top flight d1 or the fledgling NWSL level. But since the academy has come to town they have eliminated boys u15 to u18 teams from being relevant in the Region or Nation, as was the case prior to Timbers DA.

It's very difficult to quantify anything a local girls club team does in the ECNL as they only have the NW Conference/Mountain Division to compare themselves against 1 other Oregon club team, 2 Wa. club teams, 1 Idaho club team and 1 Utah club team. After a quick glance Washington's 2 clubs across the board u14 to 18 perform better than the 2 Oregon clubs. Oregon on the other hand didn't win a single division title from u14 to 18 with 7 of th 8 teams finishing no higher than 3rd or 4th some even finished last. Most telling is the Idaho club actually won 2 of the divisions. Which is very disturbing for the state of girls soccer in Oregon.

[Unregistered]

I think this a stupid question, but college placement isnt even close. Maybe it is because more scholly's available on the girls side, but CU has more placements on 1 team than all of the Academy

Boys
http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/searc...ea=commitments

Girls
http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/searc...ea=commitments

You don't know anything about recruitment. There are a fraction of money for boys compared to girls.

Comparing these two is like saying boys and girls soccer is equal when a boy at u16 could play on a d1 woman's team but wouldn't make it off the bench at Akron men's.

[Unregistered]

Boys have many disadvantages compared to girls, the biggest is they don't focus on academics like girls do. That's one of the reasons it's easy for an average girls player to get a scholarship they get great grades and test scores. The male counterpart unfortunately relies on their on the field ability to often and has no takers at that level then they compound it with crap grades.

The Portland market does produce a few Boys playing at the top level of D1 soccer, Youth Nat and MLS does produce some studs every few years, at a much better clip than the Portland area girls side which has no such presence at top flight d1 or the fledgling NWSL level. But since the academy has come to town they have eliminated boys u15 to u18 teams from being relevant in the Region or Nation, as was the case prior to Timbers DA.

It's very difficult to quantify anything a local girls club team does in the ECNL as they only have the NW Conference/Mountain Division to compare themselves against 1 other Oregon club team, 2 Wa. club teams, 1 Idaho club team and 1 Utah club team. After a quick glance Washington's 2 clubs across the board u14 to 18 perform better than the 2 Oregon clubs. Oregon on the other hand didn't win a single division title from u14 to 18 with 7 of th 8 teams finishing no higher than 3rd or 4th some even finished last. Most telling is the Idaho club actually won 2 of the divisions. Which is very disturbing for the state of girls soccer in Oregon.

I would say the 2 Washington ECNL clubs are very, very tough nationally; there is a good argument that the state did not have enough ECNL teams for their population (Colorado had 3 with less population) . . . rectifying next year.

[Unregistered]

One thing the boys DA does do better - accessibility.

ECNL is very expensive and excludes a number of families. Not sure girls DA will be any better on that front . . . at $500 a pop, the boys' DA at least doesn't exclude the poor.

Timbers end up owning their MLS rights, which does have a cost to the player - the better the player the bigger the cost, but for most it is irrelevant because they aren't going to play MLS.

[Unregistered]

Consider this. It's extremely difficult to get a boys scholarship vs girls.

Timbers academy has placed kids in Akron, Duke, etc. BoyS DA is for the elite.

Ecnl is watered down now with teams with G/D of -32 that don't score more than 3 goals a year. It's a poor development model and the boys DA would never allow that.

Boys timbers DA pays 500$ Bond.


Girls Ecnl is a borderline scam at 10k a year. Clubs overload rosters and cut playing time down to a 1/3 because they need to manage costs.

Boys DA tend to develop their players from U14 on. The ecnl clubs especially Fc Portland don't develop and sick their parents and coaches to recruit to replace.

Boys DA is thriving. Ecnl is becoming more obsolete especially with girls DA coming in.

Yes your local club is applying. Imagine Fc applying for a girls DA spot after screwing families on this Ecnl scam just to recruit gullible parents on something their kid would have gotten otherwise.

Once again, sorry your DD got cut from ECNL, again. Might as well cut your losses now since she also got cut from tier-3 Thorns Academy.

[Unregistered]

One thing the boys DA does do better - accessibility.

ECNL is very expensive and excludes a number of families. Not sure girls DA will be any better on that front . . . at $500 a pop, the boys' DA at least doesn't exclude the poor.

Timbers end up owning their MLS rights, which does have a cost to the player - the better the player the bigger the cost, but for most it is irrelevant because they aren't going to play MLS.

Girls DA, if it isn't stillborn which is most likely, will be MORE expensive than ECNL. If you have to ask how that could be, you don't understand how inexpensive ECNL really is.

[Unregistered]

Girls DA, if it isn't stillborn which is most likely, will be MORE expensive than ECNL. If you have to ask how that could be, you don't understand how inexpensive ECNL really is.

What is lost in all this label talk (ECNL, FWRL, OYSA, NWCL) is they are only acronyms for a LEAGUE. What your local club charges you are called fees. Your club has made a decision to join a particular LEAGUE on the Girls side of things in Oregon youth club soccer and you must pay the fee if you want to play in a particular LEAGUE. If your club made a choice to join a LEAGUE that mandates you travel to Washington, Idaho, Utah and other states for showcase events, guess what it's going to be expensive. We live in the NW corner of the United States and air travel is not cheap, throw in van travel, lodging and food and the expenses pile up. You aren't paying for better coaching, better competition or better development. Just a chance to travel to other parts of the United States with other like minded girls from little ole Oregon. It's more like a travelling social club of Girls than a top notch competitive Girls team. If they were a legitimate competitive team that then they would have State Championships, Regional Championships & maybe even a National Championship. They would have esteemed accomplished coaches and a laundry list of D1 players and pros. They don't.....Enjoy the Ride SUCKERS!!

[Unregistered]

What is lost in all this label talk (ECNL, FWRL, OYSA, NWCL) is they are only acronyms for a LEAGUE. What your local club charges you are called fees. Your club has made a decision to join a particular LEAGUE on the Girls side of things in Oregon youth club soccer and you must pay the fee if you want to play in a particular LEAGUE. If your club made a choice to join a LEAGUE that mandates you travel to Washington, Idaho, Utah and other states for showcase events, guess what it's going to be expensive. We live in the NW corner of the United States and air travel is not cheap, throw in van travel, lodging and food and the expenses pile up. You aren't paying for better coaching, better competition or better development. Just a chance to travel to other parts of the United States with other like minded girls from little ole Oregon. It's more like a travelling social club of Girls than a top notch competitive Girls team. If they were a legitimate competitive team that then they would have State Championships, Regional Championships & maybe even a National Championship. They would have esteemed accomplished coaches and a laundry list of D1 players and pros. They don't.....Enjoy the Ride SUCKERS!!

If a player is focused on what he/she wants as the outcome at the end of his/her high school experience (academics, athletics, community involvement) and is active, flexible and practical in his/her collegiate choice, then congrats on a pretty good outcome moving forward.

I agree with you about all of these clubs being able to offer opportunities to play in leagues and many offer opportunities to also play in tournaments, and some even set up scrimmages.

To those players that have gone on to play at the level of their choice, at the school of their choice, earning the degree of their choice, and after playing and traveling with the youth club of their choice, thank you for helping the beautiful game continue to be popular for today's players.

I will ignore your subjective sarcasm as it is already the boring fodder found elsewhere on this forum.

[Unregistered]

If a player is focused on what he/she wants as the outcome at the end of his/her high school experience (academics, athletics, community involvement) and is active, flexible and practical in his/her collegiate choice, then congrats on a pretty good outcome moving forward.

I agree with you about all of these clubs being able to offer opportunities to play in leagues and many offer opportunities to also play in tournaments, and some even set up scrimmages.

To those players that have gone on to play at the level of their choice, at the school of their choice, earning the degree of their choice, and after playing and traveling with the youth club of their choice, thank you for helping the beautiful game continue to be popular for today's players.

I will ignore your subjective sarcasm as it is already the boring fodder found elsewhere on this forum.

I agree players often get chosen by colleges to play at a particular level.

Please remember, this nothing to do with the Club making an elective decision to play in a League or Tournament, the player is part of a club team and cannot opt out of a club decision or she risks being dismissed from the team for not participating, even if she would never chosen to play at this level and the college coaches watching the game would never choose her to play for their school. It does nothing to make the game beautiful it's actually a smoke screen to the realities ahead. Where you have to earn your place. Not buy an airline ticket 3x a month. No sarcasm, just reality.

Mixed matched socks can be useful when you can't find a match.