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  #21  
Old 02-04-2010
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About generalizations - there are generalizations because there are statistics and averages. In the Ivy League, the school monitors the average and individual GPA of student athletes, their course choices, and their academic performance based on an expectation derived from their SAT and high school performance. In some sports, male athlete academic performance is consistently below their non-athlete peers. But not by much (on average). Outside the Ivy League (which after all prioritizes academic performance), the story is considerably different in a bad way. What I have told my son is that the time pressure caused by trying to be the best at multiple things is something that will simply continue into college. (but whether to continue to spread himself thin is, of course, his choice).
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  #22  
Old 02-04-2010
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What I have told my son is that the time pressure caused by trying to be the best at multiple things is something that will simply continue into college. (but whether to continue to spread himself thin is, of course, his choice).
It does not end in college. It is something to deal with one's entire life.
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  #23  
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The simple point I ways trying to make was that it is possible to play a high level of college athletics and still succeed in a very demanding major. It just takes one of two things. Either you are incredible gifted student or you are great at time management.

You have to remember that students that do not play a sport in college have a ton of down time to study, go out or have a part time job. If you play a sport you will have atleast 4 hours a day devoted to that sport. That is if you have practice or a home game. If you are traveling you have even more time devoted to that sport for those particular days. The time that you are playing a sport would probably have been spent studying if you are a dedicated student not playing a sport. That does not leave much time for socializing if you are on a athletic team and also a dedicated student. It is a choice that you have to make. Live for the now or live now for the future. Believe me, sacrificing now for the future is a much wiser choice.

One more side note. Your high school academics will be more important than your soccer stats when you are being recruited. I was a "B/C" student in HS. Did only enough to get by. My teamate that was part of a great double play combination was a straight "A" student. We had the same accomplishments on the field but the level of D1 schools he had going after him was higher. I had middle level D1 schools offering scholarships. I could never understand why until I got to college and had one bad semester. My college coach called me into his office and threaten to pull my scholarship if did not get my grades up. He said he would rather have a 300 hitter that is a "A" student than a 350 hitter that was a "C" student. He did not want to be bothered about worrying if I was going to be eligible from one semester to the next.

Baseball like soccer makes no money for the school. Soccer is not football or basketball where the university has a financial stake in you being eligible. In most cases they could care less. They don't want to waist scholarship money on a student/athlete that might become ineligible.

If your child has a desire and talent to play college athletics then you better stress at a young age the upmost importance of being a better student than soccer player. If they just want to play college athletics and are not a dedicated student then make sure they are playing a sport that makes the university money.

Go play college soccer and be a pre med student. You can do it. Just don't plan on having much down time to socialize. It is only four years of your young adult life. You will have plenty of time to catch up on what you sacrificed. My first four years of college was playing baseball. Sometimes it was great and sometimes it sucked. (never got to go on one spring break) I did not graduate in four years so my last year was spent as a student only. My grades went way up but that year could not compare to the four years playing college athletics.

If you are lucky enough to get the chance to play a sport in college relish every moment but relize it is just four years of a hopefully long life ahead of you. Be propery prepared for the rest of your life by making the right choices in your short time in college.
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  #24  
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If you are a serious student and hope to have a high level of academic achievment, you need to pick your school carefully. Ivy league, Williams, Duke, Stanford, etc. have environments where that more possible.
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  #25  
Old 02-09-2010
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If you are a serious student and hope to have a high level of academic achievment, you need to pick your school carefully. Ivy league, Williams, Duke, Stanford, etc. have environments where that more possible.
I replied to the above post, but consider it also an answer to all the posts upthread cautioning about the inability of students to succeed academically while competing at college sports.

I suggest everyone look over the link below, listing the 145 men's and 338 women's college soccer teams that have posted a team gpa of at least 3.0 or higher.

I would like to make a few points. You cannot make any generalizations about conferences. I am mainly, well actually only really interested in the men's side, but I am sure those interested in women's can chime in with similar analysis.

I find it interesting that Dartmouth college shows up with a 3.46 on the men's side, but Harvard does not. Most of the other Ivy's are present.

Amherst College shows up with a 3.47, but Williams does not (they do on the women's side). No Middlebury, no Wesleyan. In fact, the only other NESCACs I see is Colby at 3.34. and Conn college at 3.25.

Patriot League is interesting too. Bucknell is there with 3.28, Colgate with 3.16 American at 3.25, lafayette at 3.21. No Lehigh. No Holy Cross. I know Bucknell is among the last to offer athletic scholarships in the Patriot League, yet have been one of the better teams in recent years.

Some other amazingly good schools that have high GPA's among players:

Carleton 3.39
Haverford 3.43
Emerson 3.40
Johns Hopkins 3.25
Skidmore 3.34

Big D1's

Stanford 3.37
Duke 3.08
University of Akron 3.27 (Hey weren't they #2 in nation)

and plenty more. the point is, people like beentheredonethat and others make it seem that academic success while playing is rare. It is not as rare as they would lead you to believe.

Look at the GPA's at some of these schools and then tell me what you think. Gpa's as high as 3.4-3.5 across an entire roster? Having been through the recruiting game, let me also tell you that you shouldn't just go NESCAC or Ivy because you assume a higher academic standard. Look at Harvard's absence from the list, as well as so many of the NESCAC's. The cultures vary so choose carefully if you have a good student/athlete to contend with.

There are many schools on the list, at all price levels and competitive levels. If you want to find a program that has a track record of good student academic achievement in mind, I suggest you keep this list handy when you develop your short lists. We did.

http://www.nscaa.com/articles/20091106144024511.php
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  #26  
Old 02-09-2010
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i replied to the above post, but consider it also an answer to all the posts upthread cautioning about the inability of students to succeed academically while competing at college sports.

I suggest everyone look over the link below, listing the 145 men's and 338 women's college soccer teams that have posted a team gpa of at least 3.0 or higher.

I would like to make a few points. You cannot make any generalizations about conferences. I am mainly, well actually only really interested in the men's side, but i am sure those interested in women's can chime in with similar analysis.

I find it interesting that dartmouth college shows up with a 3.46 on the men's side, but harvard does not. Most of the other ivy's are present.

Amherst college shows up with a 3.47, but williams does not (they do on the women's side). No middlebury, no wesleyan. In fact, the only other nescacs i see is colby at 3.34. And conn college at 3.25.

Patriot league is interesting too. Bucknell is there with 3.28, colgate with 3.16 american at 3.25, lafayette at 3.21. No lehigh. No holy cross. I know bucknell is among the last to offer athletic scholarships in the patriot league, yet have been one of the better teams in recent years.

Some other amazingly good schools that have high gpa's among players:

Carleton 3.39
haverford 3.43
emerson 3.40
johns hopkins 3.25
skidmore 3.34

big d1's

stanford 3.37
duke 3.08
university of akron 3.27 (hey weren't they #2 in nation)

and plenty more. The point is, people like beentheredonethat and others make it seem that academic success while playing is rare. It is not as rare as they would lead you to believe.

Look at the gpa's at some of these schools and then tell me what you think. Gpa's as high as 3.4-3.5 across an entire roster? Having been through the recruiting game, let me also tell you that you shouldn't just go nescac or ivy because you assume a higher academic standard. Look at harvard's absence from the list, as well as so many of the nescac's. The cultures vary so choose carefully if you have a good student/athlete to contend with.

There are many schools on the list, at all price levels and competitive levels. If you want to find a program that has a track record of good student academic achievement in mind, i suggest you keep this list handy when you develop your short lists. We did.

http://www.nscaa.com/articles/20091106144024511.php
fantastic post. Thank you!
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  #27  
Old 02-09-2010
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Harvard doesn't scale GAP like other schools, just a quirk from long ago....
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  #28  
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Harvard doesn't scale GAP like other schools, just a quirk from long ago....
You point is that all other schools grade on a curve and Harvard does not? Link or hearsay? What puts you in a position to know this?
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  #29  
Old 02-09-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
I replied to the above post, but consider it also an answer to all the posts upthread cautioning about the inability of students to succeed academically while competing at college sports.

I suggest everyone look over the link below, listing the 145 men's and 338 women's college soccer teams that have posted a team gpa of at least 3.0 or higher.

...

and plenty more. the point is, people like beentheredonethat and others make it seem that academic success while playing is rare. It is not as rare as they would lead you to believe.

Look at the GPA's at some of these schools and then tell me what you think. Gpa's as high as 3.4-3.5 across an entire roster? Having been through the recruiting game, let me also tell you that you shouldn't just go NESCAC or Ivy because you assume a higher academic standard.

http://www.nscaa.com/articles/20091106144024511.php
With grade inflation these numbers are meaningless. Not everyone should aspire to get to med school, but a 3.4 is NOT an impressive GPA, sorry. The person who posted this needs to consider that the absence of Harvard from this list, for example, likely reflects higher academic rigor there from other schools who publish that their "whole team" has a higher cumulative GPA.
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  #30  
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fantastic post. Thank you!
You are welcome. Don't forget to click through the links on the bottom for the "all-time" lists. When you see schools that have been on this list for 7-8 years out of 10, you can conclude that the reason is beyond a particularly talented cohort coming through. There are schools from D1 through D3, big reputations to relative unknowns (at least around here).
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