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    Just a soccer ramble....

    There was a day here (maybe 20 years ago and before) where the youth soccer landscape*was much easier to understand. There were only*two main types of programs - Recreational and*Select.

    Recreational: The numbers in the recreational programs were huge, and of course it was all volunteer run with mostly parent coaches. Without commenting too much on the quality of the teams, coaches and players, the program worked, and a ton of kids played soccer. Some of those Rec teams were pretty darned good, and you saw some very talented players because as Goal says the "higher-level" programs were not siphoning players off of Rec teams like they are now. Recreational teams would play in either an "in-house" association league, or a district league.

    Select/Travel: The select program were also huge. The format was that Clubs/Associations administered all teams in their area, both Rec and Select. Each club/association had the option to hold tryouts and form select teams. The best kids in the area would go try out, they'd bring in good coaches (sometimes paid) and they would compete in high-level leagues.

    District leagues:*These were run by area districts, each running their own leagues. Within the*district leagues would be multiple different divisions or sub-levels, sometimes up to 8 or 9 different levels. Each team would enter the level they thought to be most appropriate for that individual team. In our area there was no mandatory promotion/relegation system, each team/club was just expected to place their teams appropriately. Finish first place in the fourth division, move up to third; etc.

    Not any more...

    About 10-15 years ago, a movement was started by the stronger clubs that had most of the premier teams. Long story, but they weren't happy with the way the State was running the premier league, an impasse was reached, they said "fine, we're outta here" and basically withdrew from affiliation. They got together and started their own "premier" league.*And the floodgates opened.

    The qualifying tournament was done away with. Instead of each team qualifying, a whole different system was started where it was based on the CLUB meeting certain criteria (paid DOC, etc.). Once they did, they were let in, and now the whole club and ALL of their teams were "premier", without having to qualify for anything.

    From there, soccer lost containment. The concept of earning the right to call yourself premier was gone, and now not only are the "premier clubs" calling all of their teams premier, anyone else who wants to can just call themselves "premier" and there's nothing to stop them. Back in the day if a team did that without actually being in the premier league, they were exposed as liars and phonies. No one even cares now. Everybody and their little brother calls their program "Premier". Why? $$$$$. Teams that wouldn't have even been middle of the pack select teams before are calling themselves "Premier". It just sounds SO much higher and better. And the parents, who don't know the difference, line up by the tens of thousands to pay for their kid to be on a "premier" team.*Some of the premier clubs*will*create as many teams as they can at each age (C team, D team, etc. ), and call them all "premier". Some of those kids aren't even very good, and back in the day might not have even made a select team.*But the club takes everyone who shows just to form that fourth team, that kid*makes the D team and their parents post on social media "My daughter made a premier team! So proud of her!!!"

    So not only do the individual teams not have to qualify anymore, there are some cases where the kids don't even have to, because at tryouts the club took everyone who showed up. Parents want the status of having their kid play on a so-called "Premier" team SO bad that*they will go along with this and pay whatever they ask. These programs have exploded in this area. The bottom line - where there used to be only 24 teams per age/gender that were actually Premier, now there are hundreds of them; where there were only 400-500 kids in the state per age/gender who are actually on a true premier team, now there are*tens of thousands of them, per age/gender.

    The result of all of this?*The cost of soccer, on average, has skyrocketed. There are hundreds of "premier" teams per age, and hundreds of "select" teams per age. Parents are paying a lot of money even for select, and gladly do so for the bragging rights. The unfortunate result is the Recreational programs in our area have dwindled down accordingly. Any of the kids who are any good at all (and even some who aren't) get taken by their parents to select tryouts, "make" the team, and most of the Rec teams end up folding by U14.*

    The money in youth soccer is flowing like a river; premier and select programs have exploded in numbers, and tons of coaches and administrators are getting paid handsomely, some even making a living from it all. And many of the recreational U11+ programs*are almost gone. Of course, since so many more kids are playing premier/select and getting professional coaching, this has all steadily improved the level of play across the board. Right?

    Actually, all of this "improvement" in youth soccer has resulted in a Women's national team that is still very good but no longer dominant, and a Men's national team that couldn't even qualify for the world cup.

    You can't fight progress...

    #2
    Too many words to bother with.

    Comment


      #3
      Rec programs are still strong. Still have high numbers. I will say most rec programs lose teams after U14. Kids simply move on and many decide to quit the sport. That’s the way it has always been. Retention rates are lower as the kids get older.

      Comment


        #4
        Rambling is an accurate description...what’s the point? Did you go off your meds?

        Comment


          #5
          Can't believe I just read all of that. Anyway, my comment would be, and it's fairly obvious to most parents, that the overall quality of youth soccer has indeed improved. I can even see this looking at my kids' teams (teenagers) and then watching teams just 3-4 years younger. It's pretty clear those younger kids are going to be much better players when they reach their teen years than the groups my kids are currently playing with.

          There are plenty of reasons, all of which have been discussed frequently here on TS, as to why this talent improvement is not resulting in more competitive MNT and WNT. This has more to do with the quality & quantity of training top players are getting through the ages of 17-22, along with poor talent ID all around. Our youth system has plenty of problems, the primary one being affordability, but with the proliferation of full time paid coaches and DOCs, the general youth player quality has certainly improved when compared to the pool 15-20 years ago, when most kids were coached by parent volunteers with no knowledge of the game.

          Comment


            #6
            Whether it was back in the day or now, it was equally foolish to be bragging about what soccer team your kid played on. Nobody cared then, and nobody cares now. As in all youth sports, people found a way to profit off gullible parents. Supply and demand.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
              Too many words to bother with.
              Agreed.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                There was a day here (maybe 20 years ago and before) where the youth soccer landscape*was much easier to understand. There were only*two main types of programs - Recreational and*Select.

                Recreational: The numbers in the recreational programs were huge, and of course it was all volunteer run with mostly parent coaches. Without commenting too much on the quality of the teams, coaches and players, the program worked, and a ton of kids played soccer. Some of those Rec teams were pretty darned good, and you saw some very talented players because as Goal says the "higher-level" programs were not siphoning players off of Rec teams like they are now. Recreational teams would play in either an "in-house" association league, or a district league.

                Select/Travel: The select program were also huge. The format was that Clubs/Associations administered all teams in their area, both Rec and Select. Each club/association had the option to hold tryouts and form select teams. The best kids in the area would go try out, they'd bring in good coaches (sometimes paid) and they would compete in high-level leagues.

                District leagues:*These were run by area districts, each running their own leagues. Within the*district leagues would be multiple different divisions or sub-levels, sometimes up to 8 or 9 different levels. Each team would enter the level they thought to be most appropriate for that individual team. In our area there was no mandatory promotion/relegation system, each team/club was just expected to place their teams appropriately. Finish first place in the fourth division, move up to third; etc.

                Not any more...

                About 10-15 years ago, a movement was started by the stronger clubs that had most of the premier teams. Long story, but they weren't happy with the way the State was running the premier league, an impasse was reached, they said "fine, we're outta here" and basically withdrew from affiliation. They got together and started their own "premier" league.*And the floodgates opened.

                The qualifying tournament was done away with. Instead of each team qualifying, a whole different system was started where it was based on the CLUB meeting certain criteria (paid DOC, etc.). Once they did, they were let in, and now the whole club and ALL of their teams were "premier", without having to qualify for anything.

                From there, soccer lost containment. The concept of earning the right to call yourself premier was gone, and now not only are the "premier clubs" calling all of their teams premier, anyone else who wants to can just call themselves "premier" and there's nothing to stop them. Back in the day if a team did that without actually being in the premier league, they were exposed as liars and phonies. No one even cares now. Everybody and their little brother calls their program "Premier". Why? $$$$$. Teams that wouldn't have even been middle of the pack select teams before are calling themselves "Premier". It just sounds SO much higher and better. And the parents, who don't know the difference, line up by the tens of thousands to pay for their kid to be on a "premier" team.*Some of the premier clubs*will*create as many teams as they can at each age (C team, D team, etc. ), and call them all "premier". Some of those kids aren't even very good, and back in the day might not have even made a select team.*But the club takes everyone who shows just to form that fourth team, that kid*makes the D team and their parents post on social media "My daughter made a premier team! So proud of her!!!"

                So not only do the individual teams not have to qualify anymore, there are some cases where the kids don't even have to, because at tryouts the club took everyone who showed up. Parents want the status of having their kid play on a so-called "Premier" team SO bad that*they will go along with this and pay whatever they ask. These programs have exploded in this area. The bottom line - where there used to be only 24 teams per age/gender that were actually Premier, now there are hundreds of them; where there were only 400-500 kids in the state per age/gender who are actually on a true premier team, now there are*tens of thousands of them, per age/gender.

                The result of all of this?*The cost of soccer, on average, has skyrocketed. There are hundreds of "premier" teams per age, and hundreds of "select" teams per age. Parents are paying a lot of money even for select, and gladly do so for the bragging rights. The unfortunate result is the Recreational programs in our area have dwindled down accordingly. Any of the kids who are any good at all (and even some who aren't) get taken by their parents to select tryouts, "make" the team, and most of the Rec teams end up folding by U14.*

                The money in youth soccer is flowing like a river; premier and select programs have exploded in numbers, and tons of coaches and administrators are getting paid handsomely, some even making a living from it all. And many of the recreational U11+ programs*are almost gone. Of course, since so many more kids are playing premier/select and getting professional coaching, this has all steadily improved the level of play across the board. Right?

                Actually, all of this "improvement" in youth soccer has resulted in a Women's national team that is still very good but no longer dominant, and a Men's national team that couldn't even qualify for the world cup.

                You can't fight progress...
                This again? Really?

                Your annual republish is like is right of passage. Maybe you should post them all in a retro reflection of your take on this crisis and the new words you have learned over the years. At least you are starting to use the return key, finally.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Women's national team is no longer 100% dominant because other countries have gone from investing NOTHING in women's sports to investing at least something. US women have lost their early title 9 advantage. Good for soccer all around not to have one team be 100% dominant.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    Women's national team is no longer 100% dominant because other countries have gone from investing NOTHING in women's sports to investing at least something. US women have lost their early title 9 advantage. Good for soccer all around not to have one team be 100% dominant.
                    This. Title IX and Women's College Soccer was the only reason USWNT dominated. No one anywhere else in the world cared about the women's game and thus no investment. That is no longer the case, so of course it is more competitive. I will also disagree, we just won the Women's World Cup, defeating soundly the top women's teams in the world, England, France, etc. We are still the best.

                    As to the men's, we lag behind the world because our professional MLS soccer teams are easily 20-30 years behind Europe financially. Talent flows to where the money is. Our best are going to Europe, not the MLS. Add in the dilution of the college game in the US as a "Professional Finishing School" as compared to Professional clubs in Europe, and the vast majority of US players who are not "world class" are not properly prepared to compete with the best of the rest of the world. Again, it's a money thing... not enough money in professional soccer in the US as a career to risk not going to college, unless you can go to Europe and land a big contract.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      This. Title IX and Women's College Soccer was the only reason USWNT dominated. No one anywhere else in the world cared about the women's game and thus no investment. That is no longer the case, so of course it is more competitive. I will also disagree, we just won the Women's World Cup, defeating soundly the top women's teams in the world, England, France, etc. We are still the best.

                      As to the men's, we lag behind the world because our professional MLS soccer teams are easily 20-30 years behind Europe financially. Talent flows to where the money is. Our best are going to Europe, not the MLS. Add in the dilution of the college game in the US as a "Professional Finishing School" as compared to Professional clubs in Europe, and the vast majority of US players who are not "world class" are not properly prepared to compete with the best of the rest of the world. Again, it's a money thing... not enough money in professional soccer in the US as a career to risk not going to college, unless you can go to Europe and land a big contract.
                      And our best number less than a dozen....
                      Anybody know what happened to #22 at Chelsea?
                      Don’t see that much of him....jersey sales drop?

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        And our best number less than a dozen....
                        Anybody know what happened to #22 at Chelsea?
                        Don’t see that much of him....jersey sales drop?
                        People constantly complain that American players can't compete. One player does pretty well for himself, playing for Dortmund and in Champions League matches, makes a move to one of the Big Six Premier League teams and less than two months into the season, people are criticizing him for his playing time. Perhaps you should take a step back and realize just how much he has achieved? Maybe be a little supportive even? Nah, more fun to bash, right?

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          People constantly complain that American players can't compete. One player does pretty well for himself, playing for Dortmund and in Champions League matches, makes a move to one of the Big Six Premier League teams and less than two months into the season, people are criticizing him for his playing time. Perhaps you should take a step back and realize just how much he has achieved? Maybe be a little supportive even? Nah, more fun to bash, right?
                          Agreed. He’s a young player that has come a long way in a short time. Here’s the manager’s reasoning on his playing time:
                          https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbs...the-bench/amp/

                          Comment


                            #14
                            What do the *s mean?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              Whether it was back in the day or now, it was equally foolish to be bragging about what soccer team your kid played on. Nobody cared then, and nobody cares now. As in all youth sports, people found a way to profit off gullible parents. Supply and demand.
                              Well said. And I don't hear much bragging anyway. Most parents are smart enough to stay away from that. The ones that do brag are laughed at behind their backs.
                              Soccer platforms haven't changed much over the years, other than more clubs and club teams available for the masses. You still have your in-town rec teams, town travel (MTOC), and club teams for those that want to train and play more. Whether the clubs want to call teams "premier", "select," "elite,", blue, white, or red, no one outside of the club really cares. As long as Johnny and Suzie are having fun and enjoying the sport, that is all their parents should care about.

                              Comment

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