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**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 12:52 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

I have read many threads here that say youth soccer participation is down by such and such percent yet I see clubs growing. I have a sophomore in college and she has been with Stars in Lancaster since she was 11 years old. The number of Stars teams is exponentially greater now than when she started. I do see our town�s travel program decreasing but other clubs around us are growing as well. It seems more people choose club teams and choose them earlier than before. Years ago it seemed people left their town teams when their excelling players were around 12-14 years old but now kids start straight away at like 6 or 7 with club programs. And saying leagues are watered down? Not sure as I think there are just more and more players and more divisions and more leagues. Top of the top is still top of the top, in fact I see top teams as stronger teams now than before. I also have two younger players in various programs and their teams are much stronger than the teams my oldest played on.
So why all the doom and gloom?

Overall the participation #s are down, but primarily in lower socio-economic areas. Athletes are foregoing the traditional low-cost "travel" programs and jumping on board with high cost clubs and leagues. Those who can't afford high cost options are walking away from the sport with the "why bother" attitude if they aren't on teams that are considered competitive. Don't forget to factor in that lacrosse is currently the fastest growing sport in the country, up %158 in the last 2 years.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 01:06 PM

Because the politics (club and college) in lacrosse are much less. My kids played it as well. Actually i liked it better.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

Because the politics (club and college) in lacrosse are much less. My kids played it as well. Actually i liked it better.

Boys lacrosse seems to be taking share mostly from baseball
Girls lacrosse is attracting a lot of soccer players

in addition to being more active than baseball and more exciting (scoring)!than soccer, my opinion is that suburban parents think they can navigate the lacrosse pyramid more successfully.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 01:50 PM

Lacrosse is a sport that is dominated by athletes with strength, speed, quickness, and aggression. It doesn't require great technical skill that takes years and years of practice to acquire. An excellent athlete can be impactful within a couple of years of picking up the sport.

In contrast, imagine a 13 year old boy that is a strong athlete starting soccer at that age. It would be difficult to imagine that boy ever making a high level club team.

Americans like goals scored.
Americans like physical aggression and lots of contact.
Americans want immediate gratification.
Many Americans don't appreciate the beauty of soccer because they don't understand the game or its tactical nuances.

Look at it this way: Do you think most Americans would prefer watching a 20 pass buildup that results in a class goal OR a big, strong, fast kid chasing down an opponent, winning the ball, then racing back upfield in the opposite direction past 5-6 opponents to go in on goal to score? The latter is something that happens in lacrosse often enough, but not in soccer above U10.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 01:55 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

Lacrosse is a sport that is dominated by athletes with strength, speed, quickness, and aggression. It doesn't require great technical skill that takes years and years of practice to acquire. An excellent athlete can be impactful within a couple of years of picking up the sport.

In contrast, imagine a 13 year old boy that is a strong athlete starting soccer at that age. It would be difficult to imagine that boy ever making a high level club team.

Americans like goals scored.
Americans like physical aggression and lots of contact.
Americans want immediate gratification.
Many Americans don't appreciate the beauty of soccer because they don't understand the game or its tactical nuances.

Look at it this way: Do you think most Americans would prefer watching a 20 pass buildup that results in a class goal OR a big, strong, fast kid chasing down an opponent, winning the ball, then racing back upfield in the opposite direction past 5-6 opponents to go in on goal to score? The latter is something that happens in lacrosse often enough, but not in soccer above U10.

Also, Americans LOVE to dominate sports that few other nations play. Lacrosse is tailor made for them.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

I have read many threads here that say youth soccer participation is down by such and such percent yet I see clubs growing. I have a sophomore in college and she has been with Stars in Lancaster since she was 11 years old. The number of Stars teams is exponentially greater now than when she started. I do see our town�s travel program decreasing but other clubs around us are growing as well. It seems more people choose club teams and choose them earlier than before. Years ago it seemed people left their town teams when their excelling players were around 12-14 years old but now kids start straight away at like 6 or 7 with club programs. And saying leagues are watered down? Not sure as I think there are just more and more players and more divisions and more leagues. Top of the top is still top of the top, in fact I see top teams as stronger teams now than before. I also have two younger players in various programs and their teams are much stronger than the teams my oldest played on.
So why all the doom and gloom?

You're seeing

- as described above, growth among families that can afford it
- elimination of lower cost options that not that long ago used to provide solid training and local games
- consolidation of clubs as the little guys get eaten up by the big clubs

What you're not seeing as much as how watered down it's all gotten. Everyone can be "elite" now but few are. Also, you're in MA, probably in a competitive school district, plus you're surrounded by club parents. In other words, your world isn't typical of all :)

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

Boys lacrosse seems to be taking share mostly from baseball
Girls lacrosse is attracting a lot of soccer players

in addition to being more active than baseball and more exciting (scoring)!than soccer, my opinion is that suburban parents think they can navigate the lacrosse pyramid more successfully.

Baseball is actually staying kind of steady. https://assets.aspeninstitute.org/co...EB_2-FINAL.pdf

Meanwhile, my D has at least 5 former soccer teammates that dropped soccer for LAX.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 02:19 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

You're seeing

- as described above, growth among families that can afford it
- elimination of lower cost options that not that long ago used to provide solid training and local games
- consolidation of clubs as the little guys get eaten up by the big clubs

What you're not seeing as much as how watered down it's all gotten. Everyone can be "elite" now but few are. Also, you're in MA, probably in a competitive school district, plus you're surrounded by club parents. In other words, your world isn't typical of all :)

I am not from this area originally. Down in MD, VA, NJ and PA girls lacrosse has been huge for quite some time. Many top national picks from this region. I have friends that were two sport d1 college athletes when that was still a popular thing, soccer and lacrosse.

Oh the good old days.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 04:07 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

I am not from this area originally. Down in MD, VA, NJ and PA girls lacrosse has been huge for quite some time. Many top national picks from this region. I have friends that were two sport d1 college athletes when that was still a popular thing, soccer and lacrosse.

Oh the good old days.

The youth sports industrial complex doesn't want multisport athletes. Another sport takes money away from theirs

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 04:39 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

I have read many threads here that say youth soccer participation is down by such and such percent yet I see clubs growing. I have a sophomore in college and she has been with Stars in Lancaster since she was 11 years old. The number of Stars teams is exponentially greater now than when she started. I do see our town�s travel program decreasing but other clubs around us are growing as well. It seems more people choose club teams and choose them earlier than before. Years ago it seemed people left their town teams when their excelling players were around 12-14 years old but now kids start straight away at like 6 or 7 with club programs. And saying leagues are watered down? Not sure as I think there are just more and more players and more divisions and more leagues. Top of the top is still top of the top, in fact I see top teams as stronger teams now than before. I also have two younger players in various programs and their teams are much stronger than the teams my oldest played on.
So why all the doom and gloom?

Club consolidation. Stars and others with more lower level teams. Town participation is down more than club is up. Nothing is on the field is really much better for it, not overall, except the pay-to-play business model. For now.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 08:21 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

Also, Americans LOVE to dominate sports that few other nations play. Lacrosse is tailor made for them.

A local bar I go to has a picture on the wall of a soccer team that used to play in the area in the 1910�s (over a hundred years ago). I asked the owner, who is in his 80�s, about it one time and why the bar/area didn�t have a men�s team anymore. He said they were all immigrants from Europe and that as their families assimilated into American life they wanted to be more �American� and play baseball and football. He had many requests over the years to sponsor different sports, but never soccer. Whatever soccer heritage that America had, it died decades ago when people stopped wanting to play a sport that originated somewhere else.

**Unregistered** · 01-26-2020, 10:17 PM

Our team lost 10 players when we had to combine the full u18 team with the remaining u19 seniors. Same thing happened last year. We also don�t have enough to field a u15 team because more than half the team is 9th graders and they play high school. The 8 8th graders don�t have a team to play on. A couple switched to lacrosse and a couple just plain quit out of frustration.

**Unregistered** · 01-27-2020, 01:28 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

Our team lost 10 players when we had to combine the full u18 team with the remaining u19 seniors. Same thing happened last year. We also don�t have enough to field a u15 team because more than half the team is 9th graders and they play high school. The 8 8th graders don�t have a team to play on. A couple switched to lacrosse and a couple just plain quit out of frustration.

The club should be facilitating the trapped 8th graders and trapped seniors. Can't be the only group of 8th graders in the club unless it is a very small club (in which case, you get what you pay for and probably should look to a bigger club). My kid's club has multiple teams in most ages and so trapped players will combine for the Fall and play club while 9th graders play HS, then go back to their respective teams when HS is done.

Having said all that, it sucks. Grade-based worked better and I absolutely believe soccer participating is down because of the BY change. The disruption to teams initially was fairly significant and now the trapped players get screwed more often than not.

FWIW, US Soccer doesn't care as they only care about DA and National team prospects. Grassroots soccer in this country is a joke in part because US Soccer is incompetent.

**Unregistered** · 01-27-2020, 03:26 PM

Originally posted by Unregistered View Post

The club should be facilitating the trapped 8th graders and trapped seniors. Can't be the only group of 8th graders in the club unless it is a very small club (in which case, you get what you pay for and probably should look to a bigger club). My kid's club has multiple teams in most ages and so trapped players will combine for the Fall and play club while 9th graders play HS, then go back to their respective teams when HS is done.

Having said all that, it sucks. Grade-based worked better and I absolutely believe soccer participating is down because of the BY change. The disruption to teams initially was fairly significant and now the trapped players get screwed more often than not.

FWIW, US Soccer doesn't care as they only care about DA and National team prospects. Grassroots soccer in this country is a joke in part because US Soccer is incompetent.

Not the poster but a lot of clubs aren't big enough to have a combined group of trapped players, plus they need a league to play in. Kids at smaller clubs are the ones really screwed. Even if the club or league lets them play with the younger team in the fall, it isn't the same thing as playing with your older teammates. Also, it creates friction with the families since their kids' PT may be cut to accommodate players that aren't going to be there all year.

A friend in CT had a worse story - I guess CT has a later school start cutoff so not as many 8th grade kids get caught like here. They had moved from another state with a different school cutoff and his D was the only one with no team to play on in the fall of 8th grade.