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    HS versus Club Observation of Son

    This is more of an observation by a father who can't wait for the club season to start.

    So my son plays every minute of every game at center mid for one of the better U16 teams in the region but it's amazing and frustrating to see how invisible he sometimes looks out on the field with his HS varsity team. Because his club team plays a very ball control "system" he almost plays kind of a point guard position out there distributing it all over the field. However in HS, it's all kick and run and he finds himself barely touching the ball while playing the middle of the field for every entire game! The team is horrible and it's very painful to watch the lack of quality soccer out there.

    I know if he relied only on college coaches coming to a HS game to scout him out he would never get an offer. Instead him and about 7 or 8 of his club team mates are beginning to get noticed at the club level.

    Just an observation but sometimes you forget this is truly is a team game.

    2 more years of this?? Father rant over.

    #2
    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
    This is more of an observation by a father who can't wait for the club season to start.

    So my son plays every minute of every game at center mid for one of the better U16 teams in the region but it's amazing and frustrating to see how invisible he sometimes looks out on the field with his HS varsity team. Because his club team plays a very ball control "system" he almost plays kind of a point guard position out there distributing it all over the field. However in HS, it's all kick and run and he finds himself barely touching the ball while playing the middle of the field for every entire game! The team is horrible and it's very painful to watch the lack of quality soccer out there.

    I know if he relied only on college coaches coming to a HS game to scout him out he would never get an offer. Instead him and about 7 or 8 of his club team mates are beginning to get noticed at the club level.

    Just an observation but sometimes you forget this is truly is a team game.

    2 more years of this?? Father rant over.
    So, do everyone a favor and don't go to his games. Easy.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
      So, do everyone a favor and don't go to his games. Easy.
      dbag response. do us a favor and if you don't have anything to add then keep the snark to yourself

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
        This is more of an observation by a father who can't wait for the club season to start.

        So my son plays every minute of every game at center mid for one of the better U16 teams in the region but it's amazing and frustrating to see how invisible he sometimes looks out on the field with his HS varsity team. Because his club team plays a very ball control "system" he almost plays kind of a point guard position out there distributing it all over the field. However in HS, it's all kick and run and he finds himself barely touching the ball while playing the middle of the field for every entire game! The team is horrible and it's very painful to watch the lack of quality soccer out there.

        I know if he relied only on college coaches coming to a HS game to scout him out he would never get an offer. Instead him and about 7 or 8 of his club team mates are beginning to get noticed at the club level.

        Just an observation but sometimes you forget this is truly is a team game.

        2 more years of this?? Father rant over.
        I have to say I have a similar observation. My son is very involved in the offense at the club level and is not visible at all during the HS games.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
          This is more of an observation by a father who can't wait for the club season to start.

          So my son plays every minute of every game at center mid for one of the better U16 teams in the region but it's amazing and frustrating to see how invisible he sometimes looks out on the field with his HS varsity team. Because his club team plays a very ball control "system" he almost plays kind of a point guard position out there distributing it all over the field. However in HS, it's all kick and run and he finds himself barely touching the ball while playing the middle of the field for every entire game! The team is horrible and it's very painful to watch the lack of quality soccer out there.

          I know if he relied only on college coaches coming to a HS game to scout him out he would never get an offer. Instead him and about 7 or 8 of his club team mates are beginning to get noticed at the club level.

          Just an observation but sometimes you forget this is truly is a team game.

          2 more years of this?? Father rant over.

          Father of a HS girl -
          The thing I don't understand is this...

          Not every club team is the best team in the state, but everybody that isn't doesn't "suck". You can still be a pretty decent club team with reasonably skilled players as a top-25 team in your age group in the state, IMO.

          So if there are 17 kids per team, and 100 teams (25 each at U15-U18)... that's 1700 reasonably skilled club-level players that are playing in HS. Simple math going the other way... that should be enough to have 100 reasonably skilled high school teams in MA.

          So where are those teams... and where is the disconnect?
          - Are the kids in poorer physical condition because their season just changed from "Aug-June" to "Aug-Oct and Mar-June"?
          - Is it the level of coaching?
          - Is the HS season too short to develop crisp play?
          - Is it a strategic move to try to win games (or more specifically not lose them, in HS) as opposed to developing overall skills (in club)?
          - Could it be that kick-and-run can be effective against a sweeper (which many teams still employ), which opens up the long-ball down the wing?

          Everybody says that HS soccer is ugly, kick and run soccer. I'd be interested to hear what people think the solution is.

          My reaction is that it starts with having a qualified (read: licensed and with some playing experience) coach who comes to practice with a gameplan in mind. That candidate can be hard to find considering the small pricetag put on a HS coaching position.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
            Father of a HS girl -
            The thing I don't understand is this...

            Not every club team is the best team in the state, but everybody that isn't doesn't "suck". You can still be a pretty decent club team with reasonably skilled players as a top-25 team in your age group in the state, IMO.

            So if there are 17 kids per team, and 100 teams (25 each at U15-U18)... that's 1700 reasonably skilled club-level players that are playing in HS. Simple math going the other way... that should be enough to have 100 reasonably skilled high school teams in MA.

            So where are those teams... and where is the disconnect?
            - Are the kids in poorer physical condition because their season just changed from "Aug-June" to "Aug-Oct and Mar-June"?
            - Is it the level of coaching?
            - Is the HS season too short to develop crisp play?
            - Is it a strategic move to try to win games (or more specifically not lose them, in HS) as opposed to developing overall skills (in club)?
            - Could it be that kick-and-run can be effective against a sweeper (which many teams still employ), which opens up the long-ball down the wing?

            Everybody says that HS soccer is ugly, kick and run soccer. I'd be interested to hear what people think the solution is.

            My reaction is that it starts with having a qualified (read: licensed and with some playing experience) coach who comes to practice with a gameplan in mind. That candidate can be hard to find considering the small pricetag put on a HS coaching position.
            My opinion is that when kids can play undisciplined they will. Some HS coaches do not hold their players to a better standard

            Comment


              #7
              I'm not sure where all the "good" players are either. Only about 1/3 of our HS boys play some kind of organized soccer whether rec or club. The rest do not. There is just an overall lack of skill. Each year it doesn't change much. The boys just get older.

              Comment


                #8
                Not surprised to see complaints about the quality of HS soccer, but I find the OP's observation surprising. I've watched HS soccer for a number of years and the best players always are very involved and the most noticeable. The team must be really, really bad or else the parent is overstimating the impact he believes his kid should be having. Most decent high school teams have at least a handful of players who have played club, and the players who win all-state and above accolades at the end of the season are almost all club players.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                  Father of a HS girl -


                  Everybody says that HS soccer is ugly, kick and run soccer. I'd be interested to hear what people think the solution is.

                  My reaction is that it starts with having a qualified (read: licensed and with some playing experience) coach who comes to practice with a gameplan in mind. That candidate can be hard to find considering the small pricetag put on a HS coaching position.
                  I think the solution is for players and parents to view HS soccer as something to do for kicks, for being with your school friends, for representing your school. For fun, period. Save the hard work and high expectations for club. Not all your HS teammates are as invested in soccer as you are. That is how my child looked at it, as did I, so she didn't really care much that the skill level was far below that of her club team since her HS team has only 3 club players. She still enjoyed it, mostly from a social aspect.

                  She also played lacrosse, and I thought the team was pretty decent, for what I know of lacrosse, and the team finished near the top of its league. However, another parent, whose child played for an elite lacrosse club team, let it be known to one and all that the high school team totally sucked compared to her kid's club team.

                  Every single parent found him to be annoying (to put it mildly), and his kid found him to be a huge embarrassment.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                    I'm not sure where all the "good" players are either. Only about 1/3 of our HS boys play some kind of organized soccer whether rec or club. The rest do not. There is just an overall lack of skill. Each year it doesn't change much. The boys just get older.
                    It will change but perhaps too late for your son. The club boom over the last decade will improve the quality of HS soccer. At u11 there are now some 120 NEP and Maple teams, some 2,500 players. Within a few years, virtually every HS team will be overwhelmingly composed of club players. That's already the case now with the top HS teams.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                      It will change but perhaps too late for your son. The club boom over the last decade will improve the quality of HS soccer. At u11 there are now some 120 NEP and Maple teams, some 2,500 players. Within a few years, virtually every HS team will be overwhelmingly composed of club players. That's already the case now with the top HS teams.
                      Meant 1,500 players.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                        Father of a HS girl -
                        The thing I don't understand is this...

                        Not every club team is the best team in the state, but everybody that isn't doesn't "suck". You can still be a pretty decent club team with reasonably skilled players as a top-25 team in your age group in the state, IMO.

                        So if there are 17 kids per team, and 100 teams (25 each at U15-U18)... that's 1700 reasonably skilled club-level players that are playing in HS. Simple math going the other way... that should be enough to have 100 reasonably skilled high school teams in MA.

                        So where are those teams... and where is the disconnect?
                        - Are the kids in poorer physical condition because their season just changed from "Aug-June" to "Aug-Oct and Mar-June"?
                        - Is it the level of coaching?
                        - Is the HS season too short to develop crisp play?
                        - Is it a strategic move to try to win games (or more specifically not lose them, in HS) as opposed to developing overall skills (in club)?
                        - Could it be that kick-and-run can be effective against a sweeper (which many teams still employ), which opens up the long-ball down the wing?

                        Everybody says that HS soccer is ugly, kick and run soccer. I'd be interested to hear what people think the solution is.

                        My reaction is that it starts with having a qualified (read: licensed and with some playing experience) coach who comes to practice with a gameplan in mind. That candidate can be hard to find considering the small pricetag put on a HS coaching position.
                        There's are other ways to look at the math. One is that there are about 400 high school soccer teams in the state, MIAA and NEPSAC combined, so the estimated 1700 players averages out to about 4 per team. The original point worth emphasizing is how much of a team game it is. If your team is at the average with 4 good players, and they're on the field with 6-7 that are not at their level, it isn't pretty.

                        Another thing to point out is that this average should NOT be used to denigrate all HS soccer as bad. Those same numbers, when applied to the fact that the state has a wide range in enrollment at its high schools, means that the large schools and private schools are likely to have more of those hypothetical 1700 kids. Get a league with a lot of d1-size schools, like the 8 in Bay State Conference, and many of the games, not all, resemble the club soccer that the OP is used to.

                        Like the saner comments in the thread about DA soccer, each players situation is different, which is why it can be absolutely the right thing for one player to choose DA and miss HS soccer, and just as right for another to decline a DA offer and play HS + club.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                          There's are other ways to look at the math. One is that there are about 400 high school soccer teams in the state, MIAA and NEPSAC combined, so the estimated 1700 players averages out to about 4 per team. The original point worth emphasizing is how much of a team game it is. If your team is at the average with 4 good players, and they're on the field with 6-7 that are not at their level, it isn't pretty.

                          Another thing to point out is that this average should NOT be used to denigrate all HS soccer as bad. Those same numbers, when applied to the fact that the state has a wide range in enrollment at its high schools, means that the large schools and private schools are likely to have more of those hypothetical 1700 kids. Get a league with a lot of d1-size schools, like the 8 in Bay State Conference, and many of the games, not all, resemble the club soccer that the OP is used to.

                          Like the saner comments in the thread about DA soccer, each players situation is different, which is why it can be absolutely the right thing for one player to choose DA and miss HS soccer, and just as right for another to decline a DA offer and play HS + club.
                          From what I've observed, a big issue with HS soccer is that it's a short season and too many of the players don't really know how to play together. There may be several high level club players on a team at a large school, but they're from different clubs, they play in different age groups, and they're only together for 10-12 weeks. The most skilled players may not really know what their teammates are going to do with or without the ball, and they may not be able to trust that the skill is there to handle certain types of plays, so they don't build an attack the way they might in a club environment. Instead, they get better results by playing more direct.

                          Contrast this with a club team, where the kids may have been together for 10 months a year for several years. With this kind of familiarity, a player has a very good sense of what kind of runs her teammates are about to make, what type of skills each has, and can anticipate the play as opposed to simply reacting to the most obvious, basic plays. Plus, the skill levels are likely to be more homogeneous.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                            From what I've observed, a big issue with HS soccer is that it's a short season and too many of the players don't really know how to play together. There may be several high level club players on a team at a large school, but they're from different clubs, they play in different age groups, and they're only together for 10-12 weeks. The most skilled players may not really know what their teammates are going to do with or without the ball, and they may not be able to trust that the skill is there to handle certain types of plays, so they don't build an attack the way they might in a club environment. Instead, they get better results by playing more direct.

                            Contrast this with a club team, where the kids may have been together for 10 months a year for several years. With this kind of familiarity, a player has a very good sense of what kind of runs her teammates are about to make, what type of skills each has, and can anticipate the play as opposed to simply reacting to the most obvious, basic plays. Plus, the skill levels are likely to be more homogeneous.
                            why try to string together 10 passes when you know that 1 or 2 of the players is going to lose the ball or make the wrong pass? play it long so that only one player has to make a play in order to get a shot off.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Unregistered View Post
                              dbag response. do us a favor and if you don't have anything to add then keep the snark to yourself
                              This guys post was complete snark. There is nothing snarky about telling this guy to stay home or stay at work and don't go to the games if he is frustrated, the game isn't fun to watch, his kid doesn't play well, etc. Nobody says that high school soccer is going to be the best quality play out there. He should know that. If it isn't an enjoyable experience for him. Stay home!

                              Comment

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